Chapter 46-2: Under Pressure

[Kc]

pew pew... enjoy. got sick, so publishing early. /hope I don't screw this up.

[TacticalJHP]

Thanks again for another early episode. Downloading it now.

Feel better soon KC. :nik:

[beans]

...and as I was about to hit the hey...part 2 was posted early... LOVE IT!

[Gooer]

Damn, im feeling the love with these early episodes..... Thank you Kc, and hope you get better!

[Gooer]

How are they torturing him, putting him on top of the truck.....? Or are they dragging him?

AND HE WAS LYING! THE LITTLE FUCK BUCKET! What a weasel.....

Not sure if i like this new Riley or not, she seems too violent..... But at least they didn't do any extreme torture like Burt had.....

[Gooer]

Lol, Saul cracking jokes about Fernando again.... At least he sounds somewhat happier.

The sweat seems to be working, surely the zombies would attack when they are this close....

[Gooer]

Oh boy, i feel like something bad is about to happen with the baby.....

Oh man, my heart jumped when the drilling started..........

Haha, Kelly is such a bad influence......

[Gooer]

Hm, so Tanya's keratin levels are going down..... Does that mean Saul's is also down? What does it even mean?

Oh shit, the Mortuary has turned into a Ground Zero type gas......

[Gooer]

That was a pretty damn cool episode. That weasel Tardust was lying the whole time, and hopefully gave up Scratch's location. Wonder if she is there, or if they find a clue as to where she fucked off to. Also, it seems Skittles' sweat actually somewhat works as a repellent, which will be interesting to see how close they can get to the base of the zombies. Also, since Tanya doesn't notice the air from Ground zero, it managed to contaminate the Mortuary. Since the body was somewhat rotted and eroded the body bag, does that mean the haze from Ground zero is actually from tones of bodies that are rotting down? And does that mean it will spread everywhere since there are dead zombies around the country?

[clem131]

This is a great episode.
Our heroes FINALLY are figuring things out. I just love it.
On the marks: someone figured out already that they probably meant protection and that's why Ink tattoed himself with them. I now think he did it in multiple languages to be sure everyone would get it regardless of their background?
The tension was unbearable for me in so many different ways:
- during the Riley and Burt scene, I was fearing some graphical torture like with Scratch and Burt, which I always skip when re-listening.
- when Michael and Co get close and personal with the korean zombie, for obvious reasons;
- the worst was with Tanya and Pegs all alone out there. Man, all the lines were like "Where did I put this EXTREMELY IMPORTANT piece of information? Oh, sure, I conveniently left it somewhere else... let me pause the description of the crucial findings to go get it and thus interrupt it until next week...". I'm glad I was wrong but I think I stopped breathing for a while. I was fearing a little one would find them, or Scratch, or whatever.

Now, the body dissolving in a cloud is interesting. Essentially I'm thinking this happened before.
Theory 1: The corpses were stuffed underground and rot until whatever makes the gas (bacteria, whatever) did its job. Then it stayed there for a long time, possibly some of the corpses turned into oil. A small quake lets the gas escape (the cracks) and boom zombie apocalypse.
Theory 2: the problem with theory 1 is that Ink cannot predict quakes; so I thought of an alternative: it could also be that some of the yellow gas was present in oil, again, oil produced by the corpses buried underground during the last mass extinction event, and that is introduced in the atmosphere through the combustion engine, although in diluted form. Ink could have figured that after so many years of using the combustion engine the concentration of the gas was about to reach critical mass at least in some of the more developed countries and thus he could have prepared accordingly.
I personally love theory 2, mostly because it makes Eugenio Barsanti (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenio_Barsanti) responsible for the whole apocalypse and thus this old message (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?5291-Chapter-44-3-Life-and-Death&p=75324&viewfull=1#post75324) becomes relevant to the scenario. :yay:

[LiamKerrington]

Hello.


How are they torturing him, putting him on top of the truck.....? Or are they dragging him?

Dragging - fast enough that he can follow the truck by running at the proper pace ...


Not sure if i like this new Riley or not, she seems too violent..... But at least they didn't do any extreme torture like Burt had.....

I completely disagree with Riley and Burt here - especially because I don't see why Riley is so focussed about it. This makes no sense to me.
Also I wonder what gives them the right to hold him as a prisoner and force him to do things. Are the actions justifiable by the means? I have trouble accepting this. So far we know that imprisonment, punishment, and torturing were mostly used by those survivalists who were "evil" in terms of this story (Mallers, Colonists before the last take-over); the one exception was Fort Irwin, when they hid Tanya ... I wonder how Riley's and Burt's behaviour relate to those other examples ...


Oh shit, the Mortuary has turned into a Ground Zero type gas......

Where in relation to Inglewood is the Mortuary? Is it as close to Inglewood that he should not make us wonder so much, 'cause Ring of Fore and shit? Or is it some kind of far away from Inglewood that the survivors should start to worry, 'cause gas and stuff seems to "undermine" the whole of LA?

Follow-up question: Is this gas-thing happening in other locations of the world as well? And are there other zombie-infested areas where some kind of weirdo zombie-lord uses symbols of protection and defense?


On the marks: someone figured out already that they probably meant protection and that's why Ink tattoed himself with them. I now think he did it in multiple languages to be sure everyone would get it regardless of their background?

Yeah, my thoughts as well. But what would this imply? That a) Ink knew about the catastrophe before it kicked in, b) Ink was part of the people/ things having started this shit, c) that the different symbols root in the same basic (monotheistic) idea?


Now, the body dissolving in a cloud is interesting. Essentially I'm thinking this happened before.
...

The way Tanya described lets me believe that there seems to be a direct link between the dissolving body and the gas ... We know and again received confirmation that the gas affects people (Pegs coughing); and from what we "know" and "assume" the gas plays a role in the whole zombie-thingy. But what exactly is it? Or is the gas some kind of counter-measurement against them zombos? I swing towards the latter idea, 'cause a) it seems to dissolve bodies after some time of exposure and b) when Inglewood was affected there were no zombs around.

Now the question: If Ink uses these symbols, does he use them in order to make zombos leave the gas-areas?

Best wishes!
Liam

[LiamKerrington]

On thing's for certain ... This chapter is all about setting up the endgame ...

And I wonder how quickly the attached smell starts wearing off and thus exposes Michael, Victor, and Saul ...

[LiamKerrington]

And Kc:

Get better! Now! Health above anything else, take care!

[Gooer]

I completely disagree with Riley and Burt here - especially because I don't see why Riley is so focussed about it. This makes no sense to me.
Also I wonder what gives them the right to hold him as a prisoner and force him to do things. Are the actions justifiable by the means? I have trouble accepting this. So far we know that imprisonment, punishment, and torturing were mostly used by those survivalists who were "evil" in terms of this story (Mallers, Colonists before the last take-over); the one exception was Fort Irwin, when they hid Tanya ... I wonder how Riley's and Burt's behaviour relate to those other examples ...

Think it's sort of good that they are after Scratch: While revenge is not good, Scratch is till after Pegs, so in a way, they are going after her to protect Pegs, although not directly.



Where in relation to Inglewood is the Mortuary? Is it as close to Inglewood that he should not make us wonder so much, 'cause Ring of Fore and shit? Or is it some kind of far away from Inglewood that the survivors should start to worry, 'cause gas and stuff seems to "undermine" the whole of LA?

Follow-up question: Is this gas-thing happening in other locations of the world as well? And are there other zombie-infested areas where some kind of weirdo zombie-lord uses symbols of protection and defense?

It used to be one of CJ's safehouses, so i would assume it was relatively far away from GZ. I remember them saying its location, but i don't remember....

[Merlin1274]

Yellow gas. Makes me think of Mustard Gas.. Has similar effect. Suffocates you.. I thought originally the gas was purple or it was a purple haze at Ground Zero.. or I am thinking of something else..

It was nice to here Vic and Saul's normal banter.. I think Saul getting out is doing him good.. But seems like Smelly Skittles is something you want to have..

The Cabin in the Woods.. Seen that horror movie.. Looks like we may seen another one.. Scratch style..

But several things about Dunbar has me worried.. Not sure why. Maybe it was me picking up on things that was not there in the conversations. But something felt ominous to me. Maybe it was a prelude to the Gas..

Last and not least.. I hope you get better KC..

[Gooer]

Guessing that the Cabin in the art work is the secret base Tardust is taking them too.

[LiamKerrington]

Could not resist ...

3142

[UndeadSweeper]

I love We're Alive in the morning.

So Riley and Burt decide in making him run instead of pulling fingers. Which I still don't like but it a better thing. Since you can at least recover from that. And by the sound of his voice this was the only thing done to him. Him hide that last site wouldn't be too sinister. She will know if he betray her and as we know that not a good thing when comes to Scratch. Compare this to Skittles worries about be found out.

It's good to hear Vic and Saul joking again. I was just wondering if he had another song ready.

Smell the rainbow!

CJ the planner is better then most zombie survivals series. Morgan from Walking Dead is the only person this ready. And privacy, Ain't Nobody Got Time For That!

Someone is a bad influence. Datu would have not approve.

How made bodies were at ground zero, could also explain why the they all disappear when the gas left.
How did Tanya count go all the way down to normal, could it have been bc she was in the presence of the great Skittles>

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

So Tardust is guantanamo'ed by Burt and Riley. This not great.

Certainly the wrong music for this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyZrK9meebo

[Gooer]

It's also good they made some headway with what the symbols mean: will we find out more about them, or will it not be needed?

Also, what was the symbol called that Tanya was describing after the Eye of Horus? Couldn't figure out the spelling of it...

[Gooer]

So Tardust is guantanamo'ed by Burt and Riley. This not great.

Certainly the wrong music for this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyZrK9meebo

They should of played it while he was being dragged, just to torment him more....

[UndeadSweeper]

They should of played it while he was being dragged, just to torment him more....

Nah, they would played Frozen "Let it go" on repeat.

[TacticalJHP]

It's also good they made some headway with what the symbols mean: will we find out more about them, or will it not be needed?

Also, what was the symbol called that Tanya was describing after the Eye of Horus? Couldn't figure out the spelling of it...

Oh, AFTER the The Eye of Horus....

Yea, i could not figure that out either

[Storm]

It's also good they made some headway with what the symbols mean: will we find out more about them, or will it not be needed?

Also, what was the symbol called that Tanya was describing after the Eye of Horus? Couldn't figure out the spelling of it...

It's the rune Algiz (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algiz)
I'm kinda more interested in the Rainbow fan though, I'd love to know where that's from or if Kc made that one up himself...

[Verse]

My Thoughts

I said before I wasn't a huge fan of torturing Tardust. That being said... there is torture and there is Torture. One can say that cutting back rations to a prisoner is torture. Locking them in solitary is torture. Both of those are not huge OMG!!! things. Nothing like being beaten with hammers and cutting off fingers.

While I am not a fan of even this much, running Tardust behind the car isn't really hardcore. It is more mental. Seems that they stop anytime they see him fall. They are not dragging him behind the car for long periods of time. It is a dark path though. While, IMO, not a big deal at the moment could turn into something really bad if the show went on for a few more seasons. If their version of torture is just lots of running, then I am not worried to much. It is petty mild to be honest. No long term damage. Just a nap and you are better.

Also I don't blame Tardust too much. The Cabin to him seems like a hail mary pass. They went there once (if he is telling the truth) and that is it. He knows that if Scratch was to kill Burt and Co at the cabin... he is SOL. The other places could be written off as 'They got lucky'. The Cabin is a giant neon sign that says "I SOLD YOU OUT" and his life has a end date. He knows the odds of him living are slim. The odds of him living with Burt and Riley are slim. He will not with Scratch. Not saying he deserves to live, but I understand him trying to save his life and trying his best to keep from dieing. He has to hope that Scratch dies at the Cabin. If she lives he is a dead man. Thus why he didn't want to mention it.

Also I hope the biodiesel conversation was a shout out to Redbeard of We're Alive Fancast. Unless KC says otherwise.. it will be in my head.

The Skittle Musk is still odd to me. He really feels like a Maguffin. We set up they track by scent, so we have a random guy produce a smell that makes him be ignored. Just very very odd to me. I would have rathered they rub poop, Zombie Blood, or waited till it rained. Just seems so very very odd. The guy that caused the fall of the last tower is invisible to Zombies. Just feels forced. Like he had to be awesome because the fans wanted him to be.

I like the way the symbols are turning out. They hit on that he had to know something. I think it was Elisa that has that theroy. The one where he tat'd himself up with a bunch of stuff hoping one would stick. If so.... High Five! You're awesome. I will have to so back and look at the thread and give ya rep for it.

I liked the way Dunbar felt like a family. Kelly being the 'Fun Aunt' and Pegs being the 'Responsible Aunt'. Was nice and fun.

Holy Crap the Haze and The Bodies. Maybe that is why Tanya's levels have been going nuts. I know that doesn't explain Saul, but it is just an idea. Wonder if the small amount of gas they put off jacked with her levels. It just wasn't enough haze to bother people yet. Her being away from the bodies for a few days allowed it to drop. Just a rough idea.

[Gooer]

It's the rune Algiz (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algiz)
I'm kinda more interested in the Rainbow fan though, I'd love to know where that's from or if Kc made that one up himself...

Ohhhh...... Couldn't think of its spelling, thought it was Algeas or something.... Thanks!

And yes, that would be interesting to know.....

[LiamKerrington]

... and Pegs being the 'Responsible Aunt'.

The Pegs is such a Care Bear ...

3143

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

They should of played it while he was being dragged, just to torment him more....

Na, there is an even better song to play at such occasions:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp0k72UA5Dk

[Gooer]

Na, there is an even better song to play at such occasions:



What a classic. Haha.

This might have made him enjoy the torture more...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgzGwKwLmgM

[pmchawk]

My Thoughts

Holy Crap the Haze and The Bodies. Maybe that is why Tanya's levels have been going nuts. I know that doesn't explain Saul, but it is just an idea. Wonder if the small amount of gas they put off jacked with her levels. It just wasn't enough haze to bother people yet. Her being away from the bodies for a few days allowed it to drop. Just a rough idea.

To explain Saul you go the other way. Tanya had been exposed to it longer then Saul so the gas dropped her levels, while Saul was only a short period of time so his levels only leveled out rather then dropped.

[Gooer]

One thing that came to mind: If a zombie jumped out at attacked Tardust while being dragged, how would Riley and Burt be able to stop it, if they were driving? unless someone was ready....

[LiamKerrington]

To explain Saul you go the other way. Tanya had been exposed to it longer then Saul so the gas dropped her levels, while Saul was only a short period of time so his levels only leveled out rather then dropped.

Which would or could mean that these gases are kind of a real Zombie-repellant ... if not zombie-germ-pesticide ...

[pmchawk]

Longer and a far more concentrated dose.

[Gooer]

The guy that caused the fall of the last tower is invisible to Zombies.

Would explain why the zombies just ran past him in Dunbar though..... although i agree, don't understand how/why it works. I trust in Kc to be able to explain it. He isn't a person that just magically makes something work. Remember the skepticism about the symbols?

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

What a classic. Haha.

This might have made him enjoy the torture more...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgzGwKwLmgM

Oh, that is a classic, man.

[TacticalJHP]

To be honest, when they came up with B&R driving, and then it revealed they had Tardust running behind the jeep, i suddenly wished they had been playing "Eye of the Tiger" on the radio in the background.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btPJPFnesV4

Not only would that have been funny, but it fit's both Burt and Riley's personality. In addition it would have added an additional amount of psychological aspect to the torture for tardust.

[Gooer]

To be honest, when they came up with B&R driving, and then it revealed they had Tardust running behind the jeep, i suddenly wished they had been playing "Eye of the Tiger" on the radio in the background.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btPJPFnesV4

Not only would that have been funny, but it fit's both Burt and Riley's personality. In addition it would have added an additional amount of psychological aspect to the torture for tardust.

Would of been another great motivator for Tardust.....

[HardKor]

OK, quite a lot to bite into in this episode, where to begin....?

I loved the comedy at Dunbar, CJ's crazy surveillance and her casual lack of understanding that some people might not like being spied on 24/7, had me in stitches. And Kelly playing the "cool aunt" role complete with "shot, shot shot!" chant...pure gold.
And I love Pegs, but she does make me facepalm a lot. Whether because she's being the stick in the mud who won't let Hope drink or her line about "When Michael says he wants to be alone, I just know it means he needs to talk." That makes me feel sorry for the guy, it really does.

Now onto more serious matters:

Haze in the Mortuary.
So Tanya seems to be through the woods when it comes to infection (although I know I can't be the only one who thought she was about to turn when she had to go back into the mortuary to get her notes. Always a bad sign when information is about to be delivered but has to be stalled.) But she is still showing signs of immunity. I really don't know what to make of all this other than what we've already learned.
The other interesting thing is that the haze seems to comes from the decomposing zombie corpses (or maybe the gas gets trapped in the zombies and then slowly leeches back out after they die?) I wonder, maybe the zombies aren't a new phenomenon. What if there have been outbreaks in the distant past, followed by lots of zombie corpses getting trapped underground, releasing gas as they decompose, then the gas gets suddenly released thousands of years later and we get a new outbreak. OK maybe that deserves a :tinfoil:

Alright and now for the final topic brought up in the episode:
The ethical treatment of prisoners (or lack thereof) by Riley and Burt.
I've always been a big fan of Riley, but I've said before that I don't like the path she's going down, and I still don't. Sure, their treatment of Tardust wasn't as bad as it could have been (as far as we know he still has all his appendages), but threatening to road haul the guy isn't something I can condone. Especially since I still don't think he was trying to hide anything and as someone else said I think the cabin was a last ditch hail mary on his part to save himself. And I wonder, if he hadn't thought of the cabin, what would Riley and Burt have done? I like to hope that the "just keep going and drag him" stuff was a bluff since not only would it have been well beyond the Moral Event Horizon, but also because it wouldn't have served their purpose of getting information. But the tone in Riley's voice makes me wonder if she isn't close to going completely off the deep end.
I don't think any of this bodes well for Riley and Burt's future in the series. Going down this kind of dark path is a good way to coax karma into taking a big bite out of your ass, and I have a feeling that whatever they find in the cabin isn't going to end well for at least one of them.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

To be honest, when they came up with B&R driving, and then it revealed they had Tardust running behind the jeep, i suddenly wished they had been playing "Eye of the Tiger" on the radio in the background.

Not only would that have been funny, but it fit's both Burt and Riley's personality. In addition it would have added an additional amount of psychological aspect to the torture for tardust.

As it appears to take some time, what about 10 hrs of this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1Kc-fAVrXw

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Or, as an alternative:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCBASt507WA

[Grognaurd]

Lots of good stuff...

Torture
The problem with it is you get the answer you want. Ask a question, get an answer. If one does not like the answer insert torture here. Rinse, lather, repeat. Burt and Riley are sure Tardust knows. He could have easily have no clue and just told them where to find Durai's dad who is way more paranoid and a hermet with beaucoup de booby traps and shoots on sight.

Corpse Gas.
Damn, It just begs the question, is there something special about the people immune or disturbed by the gas? The most likely is that there is something special about Saul and Tanya. It may correlate with Keratin level perturbation. But, this is a small sample size and I am not ready to collapse this wave function.

Biodiesel
Damn, Burt. Forget about it. You would just be chasing another logistic supply chain. He is going to need Ethanol/Methanol and a strong alkali like sodium or potassium hydroxide. They would be much better off to hit the naval yards and find some prepositioned resupply nodes.

Hope The Reveal
I have always thought her vision would get better and she would recognize someone hiding in plain sight to pull the plot together. If we think about it, she has had very little time with Burt, although I "hope" it is not one of Ink's symbles that sets her off.

Saul
I learned a long time ago to never judge a man in his grief. But damn, Saul, you leave me perplexed...

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

...
And I love Pegs, but she does make me facepalm a lot. Whether because she's being the stick in the mud who won't let Hope drink or her line about "When Michael says he wants to be alone, I just know it means he needs to talk." That makes me feel sorry for the guy, it really does.

Yeah, there is definitely a pattern why Michael conducts suicidal recon missions almost on a weekly basis.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Besides, I have to concur that Pegs actually is the

http://www.standard.co.uk/incoming/article8966342.ece/alternates/w620/76poppins2711.jpg

of We're Alive, especially in this very episode.

[Grognaurd]

Besides, I have to concur that Pegs actually is the

http://www.standard.co.uk/incoming/article8966342.ece/alternates/w620/76poppins2711.jpg

of We're Alive, especially in this very episode.

So, KC is saving the musical episode for the dancing penguins?

Don't worry, KC, I got you covered...

#flipstable

[LiamKerrington]

Besides, I have to concur that Pegs actually is the
http://www.standard.co.uk/incoming/article8966342.ece/alternates/w620/76poppins2711.jpg

of We're Alive, especially in this very episode.

A feel inclined to disagree. Since Mary Poppins is a nursery nurse, Pegs would have to be much more authoritarian and educational, which she is not. But I see her in this role some time in the far future, if she survives the final 5 episodes ...

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

By the way, I would like to point out that there are still more inhumane torture methods than the the one applied on Tardust.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0gsdLoc7mA

[TacticalJHP]

OK, quite a lot to bite into in this episode, where to begin....?

I loved the comedy at Dunbar, CJ's crazy surveillance and her casual lack of understanding that some people might not like being spied on 24/7, had me in stitches. And Kelly playing the "cool aunt" role complete with "shot, shot shot!" chant...pure gold.
And I love Pegs, but she does make me facepalm a lot. Whether because she's being the stick in the mud who won't let Hope drink or her line about "When Michael says he wants to be alone, I just know it means he needs to talk." That makes me feel sorry for the guy, it really does.


I heard that exact same statement come from my ex-wife about a MILLION times. She never took the hint.

[TacticalJHP]

Yeah, there is definitely a pattern why Michael conducts suicidal recon missions almost on a weekly basis.

OMFG, I launched Diet Mtn Dew threw my nose when I read this. It is 100% correct. :nik:

[Litmaster]

How are they torturing him, putting him on top of the truck.....? Or are they dragging him?

I got that they had him bound by the wrists with a long rope tied to their rear bumper, and were making him jog behind the truck for long distances, like this dude:


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/05/08/article-2321088-19AC04BB000005DC-710_634x417.jpg

[Litmaster]

And later that evening, Hope retires to her bedroom with a new-found hobby, thanks to Auntie Kell's fine example:


http://www.thewallofchampions.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/6.png

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

And later that evening, Hope retires to her bedroom with a new-found hobby, thanks to Auntie Kell's fine example:


http://www.thewallofchampions.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/6.png

Hope still wears glasses, does she not?

http://elitedaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/beer-cute-drink-fun-girl-glasses-Favim.com-46588.jpg

[Witch_Doctor]

For the first time I started screaming, "Oh my god! Oh my god!" while listening to W.A. Cool feeling.
The reason was because of the gas in the mortuary. It sounds like the gas is escaping from the decomposing bodies. (Not the other way around, where the gas decomposes the bodies.) The pressure of the gas building up within the bodies causes it to escape as a haze. I wondered if this could be a very ancient agent that seeped underground, escaping through volcanic and tectonic faults, after enough pressure had built up around the globe.

Or, imagine a new ground zero brewing from the 6 million missing decomposing bodies buried under L.A.

Tardust did seem to have an answer that he was holding out from Riley and Burt. He gave the same type of answer as Skittles when Micheal and C.J. asked for his help. Skittles is worried that Ink will know that he help them and Tardust says that Scratch will know that he helped Burt and Riley. So, he's been telling them of places that she could be... Riley:"Where is she?" Tardust: "Dantooine. She's on Dantooine." But he left out a particular one.

[Vlarken]

Man, Pegs is such a buzzkill! I think my favorite line of the episode, though, was Kelly saying 'shot shot shot!'. It'd be funny if alcohol actually improved Hope's vision.

About the torture: that was honestly one of the most humane ways to torture someone that they could have imagined. I thought for sure that they were going to beat the crap out of him, or use a knife like the Mallers did on Burt. I think it speaks to their characters that they chose a method that, while surely tiring him out, didn't bring about too much bodily harm. Throughout that entire scene I kept picturing that scene in Game of Thrones wherein the Dothraki tie Dany's would-be-assassin behind to a horse and have him run until he dies. Good thing Burt and Riley aren't Dothraki.

[LiamKerrington]

...the gas in the mortuary. It sounds like the gas is escaping from the decomposing bodies. (Not the other way around, where the gas decomposes the bodies.) The pressure of the gas building up within the bodies causes it to escape as a haze. I wondered if this could be a very ancient agent that seeped underground, escaping through volcanic and tectonic faults, after enough pressure had built up around the globe.

Or, imagine a new ground zero brewing from the 6 million missing decomposing bodies buried under L.A.

Oh. My. God. Yes!

[Verse]

Would explain why the zombies just ran past him in Dunbar though..... although i agree, don't understand how/why it works. I trust in Kc to be able to explain it. He isn't a person that just magically makes something work. Remember the skepticism about the symbols?

I agree. I was one of the biggest people bitching about the symbols. I even coined the Insta-Magic Language term. Now I am ok with it. Doesn't make me scream anymore. It does explain how he lived through Dunbar. Still odd. It could just also be one of those things that is needed to make a story work. This being a fictional story. What are the odds of the world falling to shit, but our core group makes it for the most part. Their Tower has fallen, the Colony Fell apart, they survived two cities falling (The Begining and Baulder), a Nuke... all with only a handful of A-List deaths. If you look at Orginal Dunbar... they all died. The End.

So it could easily be one of the "Suspence of Dis-Belief" needed for a story about Zombies.

[Grognaurd]

For the first time I started screaming, "Oh my god! Oh my god!" while listening to W.A. Cool feeling.
The reason was because of the gas in the mortuary. It sounds like the gas is escaping from the decomposing bodies. (Not the other way around, where the gas decomposes the bodies.) The pressure of the gas building up within the bodies causes it to escape as a haze. I wondered if this could be a very ancient agent that seeped underground, escaping through volcanic and tectonic faults, after enough pressure had built up around the globe.

Or, imagine a new ground zero brewing from the 6 million missing decomposing bodies buried under LA.

think it will top...

Battle of Messines*
On 7 June 1917, nineteen (of a planned twenty-one) large mines, containing a total of over 455 tons of ammonal explosives, were set off beneath German lines on the Messines-Wytschaete ridge. The explosion, which killed about 10,000 Germans, was heard as far away as London and Dublin. While determining the power of explosions is difficult, this was probably the largest planned explosion in history until the 1945 Trinity atomic weapon test, and the largest non-nuclear planned explosion until the 1947 British Heligoland detonation (below). The Messines mines detonation killed more people than any other non-nuclear man-made explosion in history.

[Gooer]

By the way, I would like to point out that there are still more inhumane torture methods than the the one applied on Tardust.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0gsdLoc7mA

What the.....

That's just gross.

[Verse]

Haze in the Mortuary.
So Tanya seems to be through the woods when it comes to infection (although I know I can't be the only one who thought she was about to turn when she had to go back into the mortuary to get her notes. Always a bad sign when information is about to be delivered but has to be stalled.) But she is still showing signs of immunity. I really don't know what to make of all this other than what we've already learned.
The other interesting thing is that the haze seems to comes from the decomposing zombie corpses (or maybe the gas gets trapped in the zombies and then slowly leeches back out after they die?) I wonder, maybe the zombies aren't a new phenomenon. What if there have been outbreaks in the distant past, followed by lots of zombie corpses getting trapped underground, releasing gas as they decompose, then the gas gets suddenly released thousands of years later and we get a new outbreak. OK maybe that deserves a :tinfoil:



I do think that the Zombie thing isn't a new deal. My gut says this has happened before, but a long long time ago. Ink had to know something was going to happen. Could be that the reason it didn't wipe out the world in the past was simply because less people, and harder to move around. Less resourses as well. Back in Yer Ole Medieval Times there wasn't roads, and cities with millions of people. And cars/boats/planes. If there were not turners in cars... the Zeds would not have reached Fort Irwin. They would have died in the snow.

Could be something like The Mayans. Outbreak happens. They turn. Then die from exposure and freaking jungle cats. Due to lack of numbers and resources they don't last long. Not saying this happened in WA, but just a base of how this could have happened in the past and we would naver would have known.

[Litmaster]

For the first time I started screaming, "Oh my god! Oh my god!" while listening to W.A. Cool feeling.
The reason was because of the gas in the mortuary. It sounds like the gas is escaping from the decomposing bodies. (Not the other way around, where the gas decomposes the bodies.) The pressure of the gas building up within the bodies causes it to escape as a haze. I wondered if this could be a very ancient agent that seeped underground, escaping through volcanic and tectonic faults, after enough pressure had built up around the globe.

Or, imagine a new ground zero brewing from the 6 million missing decomposing bodies buried under L.A.



And meanwhile, in an underground cavern deep under L.A...


http://www.the-savoisien.com/blog/public/img13/dresden-pile-of-bodies.jpg

[Litmaster]

And here's a scientific cross-section of the little-studied Zed Layer:
3145

[DagnyTag]

So decomposing Zombies release the gas from ground zero... could this be another reason the Zombies carry off their dead?

[Zombie Yeti]

Is she shooting whomp rats in her t 80 . I probably botched that oh well.
For the first time I started screaming, "Oh my god! Oh my god!" while listening to W.A. Cool feeling.
The reason was because of the gas in the mortuary. It sounds like the gas is escaping from the decomposing bodies. (Not the other way around, where the gas decomposes the bodies.) The pressure of the gas building up within the bodies causes it to escape as a haze. I wondered if this could be a very ancient agent that seeped underground, escaping through volcanic and tectonic faults, after enough pressure had built up around the globe.

Or, imagine a new ground zero brewing from the 6 million missing decomposing bodies buried under L.A.

Tardust did seem to have an answer that he was holding out from Riley and Burt. He gave the same type of answer as Skittles when Micheal and C.J. asked for his help. Skittles is worried that Ink will know that he help them and Tardust says that Scratch will know that he helped Burt and Riley. So, he's been telling them of places that she could be... Riley:"Where is she?" Tardust: "Dantooine. She's on Dantooine." But he left out a particular one.

[Zombie Yeti]

West side story style is def the way to go leather jackets etc scratch can be Maria
So, KC is saving the musical episode for the dancing penguins?

Don't worry, KC, I got you covered...

#flipstable

[beans]

*crossing my fingers* that the cause of the outbreak does not relate in any way to global warming or cooling or change or disruption or whatever new 'global _____' term is coined nowadays, that would be utterly stupid...(i'm looking at you, m night!).

*therory*:
on the other hand, all the different symbols mentioned in this episode for 'protection' from different cultures was a nice touch alluding that zombie folklore knows no bounds by culture, language, location, and time; consider WA fans, I believe not everyone here in the is from the US. if it turns out that z's as being an ancient, worldwide phenomena/plague it looks to be a beautiful way to conclude the story....can't wait for the finale!

[TacticalJHP]

And later that evening, Hope retires to her bedroom with a new-found hobby, thanks to Auntie Kell's fine example:


http://www.thewallofchampions.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/6.png


Hope still wears glasses, does she not?

http://elitedaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/beer-cute-drink-fun-girl-glasses-Favim.com-46588.jpg


Man, Pegs is such a buzzkill! I think my favorite line of the episode, though, was Kelly saying 'shot shot shot!'. It'd be funny if alcohol actually improved Hope's vision.




Well, we know Hope can't go out and get blind drunk.

[Storm]

Throughout that entire scene I kept picturing that scene in Game of Thrones wherein the Dothraki tie Dany's would-be-assassin behind to a horse and have him run until he dies. Good thing Burt and Riley aren't Dothraki.

Thanks... Now I'm trying to imagine a cross-over between WA and ASOIAF... I guess Michael would be some kind of NW guy... And Saul has finally taken the Black...
I have a feeling wildfire Works pretty well against zombies :D

[Elisa]

So decomposing Zombies release the gas from ground zero... could this be another reason the Zombies carry off their dead?

Hmm makes sense. What if all the radon experiments were underground in Inglewood pre ZA. The gas and zombie phenomenon were two after effects.

[Footbutt]

i'm not too up-in-arms about the Interrogation of Tardust.
i'm not turning a blind eye, but even the author (KC) didn't spend a lot of time on it. it was a means to progress the story and there would little or no way to get to the cabin in the woods part.

[Gnex]

The worst part of this whole episode was the banter between Saul and Victor...... Too much laughing, Too much reminiscing..........


Someone is going to die shortly and that is sad.......

[Ginja]

My question is why didn't they give Tanya some of Skittles' sweat to run tests on. I get that she's a little off right now because of recent events but she thrives when she has something to do. Plus I think if his sweat is a link to the zombies in any way, she'd WANT to test it since she has/had the keratin levels in her blood.

I'm not upset at all about the questioning of Tardust. Riley and Burt don't even know what he almost did/wanted to do to Lizzy. If Riley KNEW what he did to her in addition to what happened to Angel...dude would be z-chow quick fast and in a hurry. That epi with Tardust and Lizzy is the only one I can't listen to on repeat. I have to skip it. That jackass deserves whatever Burt and Riley do.

[LiamKerrington]

Hmm makes sense. What if all the radon experiments were underground in Inglewood pre ZA. The gas and zombie phenomenon were two after effects.

Does not explain, why zombocalypse seemed to have started in many different areas nearly simultaneously ... This would require Radon Labs and parnters would have had started shit in different locations at the same time. I am not certain, how to express it. And I may be totally wrong - but am I the only one thinking that the gas is not the 'cause of the zombocalypse, but more kind of a reaction to it?

I struggle because I think there is a vital piece of the puzzle missing.

These are the information I base my doubts on:

a) We know that dead zombies are piled up and eaten by alive zombies. And I think we can at least assume (if not be certain) that Angel, Riley, Michael, Victor, Datu, Samantha, and Saul have encountered piled up zombies at the arena. We also know that at least Victor is negatively affected by the gases. So if the dead and piled up zombies release those gases, then there would be kind of a plot-hole for Victor not showing any symptoms anymore.
Granted: Maybe the gases are released only after a certain while and only if the decompsoing and dissolving zombie-bodies remain untouched for quite a long time while they are kept in a somewhat tight and locked up place. Still: I have doubts, because ...

b) Ground zero was without zombies (except for this single encounter with the Little One), when the gases appeared. And we kind of can be certain that the gases were released through the cracks in the ground. So what, if there were no bodies scattered aroung at/ near ground zero, because the gases dissolved them over the time? Or did I miss descriptions telling us that at ground zeros the streets and places were littered with dead zombie-bodies?
So: Now we have these gases at the Mortuary. Are they there because of the dead bodies, or maybe because the basement has some kind of entry-points for the gases to get into the building?

c) Just a thought: Tanyas zombie-indicators remained low and almost vanished, because she stayed for a prolonged period of time in the Mortuary. Because she is not negatively affected by the gases, the gases might have had an imunizing effect on her and made the z-agent vanish from her body. The same gas might be the reason why the dead zombie-bodies have started to dissolve ...

Please tell me, if I miss an important piece of information here. I look forward to being falsified here ...

Best wishes!
Liam

[TacticalJHP]

My question is why didn't they give Tanya some of Skittles' sweat to run tests on. I get that she's a little off right now because of recent events but she thrives when she has something to do. Plus I think if his sweat is a link to the zombies in any way, she'd WANT to test it since she has/had the keratin levels in her blood.

I'm not upset at all about the questioning of Tardust. Riley and Burt don't even know what he almost did/wanted to do to Lizzy. If Riley KNEW what he did to her in addition to what happened to Angel...dude would be z-chow quick fast and in a hurry. That epi with Tardust and Lizzy is the only one I can't listen to on repeat. I have to skip it. That jackass deserves whatever Burt and Riley do.

I am also wondering why Tanya didn't get a blood sample from Duncan. She might have wanted to know if he may have been a slow turner and THAT could have been the reason his sweat smells different.

[Ginja]

I am also wondering why Tanya didn't get a blood sample from Duncan. She might have wanted to know if he may have been a slow turner and THAT could have been the reason his sweat smells different.

Ohhhh I didn't even THINK about his blood!! But I think you're onto something!

[MrRedBeard]

Its been a very musical thread.



.....On the marks: someone figured out already that they probably meant protection and that's why Ink tattoed himself with them. I now think he did it in multiple languages to be sure everyone would get it regardless of their background?
.....Now, the body dissolving in a cloud is interesting. Essentially I'm thinking this happened before.
Theory 1: The corpses were stuffed underground and rot until whatever makes the gas (bacteria, whatever) did its job. Then it stayed there for a long time, possibly some of the corpses turned into oil. A small quake lets the gas escape (the cracks) and boom zombie apocalypse.
Theory 2: the problem with theory 1 is that Ink cannot predict quakes; so I thought of an alternative: it could also be that some of the yellow gas was present in oil, again, oil produced by the corpses buried underground during the last mass extinction event, and that is introduced in the atmosphere through the combustion engine, although in diluted form. Ink could have figured that after so many years of using the combustion engine the concentration of the gas was about to reach critical mass at least in some of the more developed countries and thus he could have prepared accordingly.
I personally love theory 2, mostly because it makes Eugenio Barsanti (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenio_Barsanti) responsible for the whole apocalypse and thus this old message (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?5291-Chapter-44-3-Life-and-Death&p=75324&viewfull=1#post75324) becomes relevant to the scenario. :yay:

This became part of the discussion on FanCast this week. I like theory #1 for sure and #2 fits an eco scenario but seems out there but regardless I like it.



Now the question: If Ink uses these symbols, does he use them in order to make zombos leave the gas-areas?

Best wishes!
Liam

My question is if they put the 5 lines to a point with a rainbow symbol on Dunbar would the zombies leave it alone or invite them in.



I said before I wasn't a huge fan of torturing Tardust. That being said... there is torture and there is Torture. One can say that cutting back rations to a prisoner is torture. Locking them in solitary is torture. Both of those are not huge OMG!!! things. Nothing like being beaten with hammers and cutting off fingers.

While I am not a fan of even this much, running Tardust behind the car isn't really hardcore. It is more mental. Seems that they stop anytime they see him fall. They are not dragging him behind the car for long periods of time. It is a dark path though. While, IMO, not a big deal at the moment could turn into something really bad if the show went on for a few more seasons. If their version of torture is just lots of running, then I am not worried to much. It is petty mild to be honest. No long term damage. Just a nap and you are better.

.....I like the way the symbols are turning out. They hit on that he had to know something. I think it was Elisa that has that theroy. The one where he tat'd himself up with a bunch of stuff hoping one would stick. If so.... High Five! You're awesome. I will have to so back and look at the thread and give ya rep for it.


This was also a point of discussion on the FanCast. Right there with you on the torture. Riley is starting to parallel Scratch in some ways and makes me agree with Osiris's thoughts from the last thread a bit more about who was the antagonist.


Also I hope the biodiesel conversation was a shout out to Redbeard of We're Alive Fancast. Unless KC says otherwise.. it will be in my head.

Ha! Yea KC didn't really see Bio-Diesel as a viable option.


One thing that came to mind: If a zombie jumped out at attacked Tardust while being dragged, how would Riley and Burt be able to stop it, if they were driving? unless someone was ready....

Kinda like fishing... I see a new sport!



Now onto more serious matters:

Haze in the Mortuary.
So Tanya seems to be through the woods when it comes to infection (although I know I can't be the only one who thought she was about to turn when she had to go back into the mortuary to get her notes. Always a bad sign when information is about to be delivered but has to be stalled.) But she is still showing signs of immunity. I really don't know what to make of all this other than what we've already learned.
The other interesting thing is that the haze seems to comes from the decomposing zombie corpses (or maybe the gas gets trapped in the zombies and then slowly leeches back out after they die?) I wonder, maybe the zombies aren't a new phenomenon. What if there have been outbreaks in the distant past, followed by lots of zombie corpses getting trapped underground, releasing gas as they decompose, then the gas gets suddenly released thousands of years later and we get a new outbreak. OK maybe that deserves a :tinfoil:

Alright and now for the final topic brought up in the episode:
The ethical treatment of prisoners (or lack thereof) by Riley and Burt.
I've always been a big fan of Riley, but I've said before that I don't like the path she's going down, and I still don't. Sure, their treatment of Tardust wasn't as bad as it could have been (as far as we know he still has all his appendages), but threatening to road haul the guy isn't something I can condone. Especially since I still don't think he was trying to hide anything and as someone else said I think the cabin was a last ditch hail mary on his part to save himself. And I wonder, if he hadn't thought of the cabin, what would Riley and Burt have done? I like to hope that the "just keep going and drag him" stuff was a bluff since not only would it have been well beyond the Moral Event Horizon, but also because it wouldn't have served their purpose of getting information. But the tone in Riley's voice makes me wonder if she isn't close to going completely off the deep end.
I don't think any of this bodes well for Riley and Burt's future in the series. Going down this kind of dark path is a good way to coax karma into taking a big bite out of your ass, and I have a feeling that whatever they find in the cabin isn't going to end well for at least one of them.

Right up there with Clem but more refined. I like this theory a lot. Also a point of discussion.



Torture
The problem with it is you get the answer you want. Ask a question, get an answer. If one does not like the answer insert torture here. Rinse, lather, repeat. Burt and Riley are sure Tardust knows. He could have easily have no clue and just told them where to find Durai's dad who is way more paranoid and a hermet with beaucoup de booby traps and shoots on sight.

Corpse Gas.
Damn, It just begs the question, is there something special about the people immune or disturbed by the gas? The most likely is that there is something special about Saul and Tanya. It may correlate with Keratin level perturbation. But, this is a small sample size and I am not ready to collapse this wave function.

Biodiesel
Damn, Burt. Forget about it. You would just be chasing another logistic supply chain. He is going to need Ethanol/Methanol and a strong alkali like sodium or potassium hydroxide. They would be much better off to hit the naval yards and find some prepositioned resupply nodes.


Points of discussion on the fancast. I completely agree with you on the subject of torture. What if he didn't know anything else and just felt pressure to give any answer? As far as Biodiesel - Wood Gas & Lye Soap


Yeah, there is definitely a pattern why Michael conducts suicidal recon missions almost on a weekly basis.
Haha


For the first time I started screaming, "Oh my god! Oh my god!" while listening to W.A. Cool feeling.
The reason was because of the gas in the mortuary. It sounds like the gas is escaping from the decomposing bodies. (Not the other way around, where the gas decomposes the bodies.) The pressure of the gas building up within the bodies causes it to escape as a haze. I wondered if this could be a very ancient agent that seeped underground, escaping through volcanic and tectonic faults, after enough pressure had built up around the globe.

Or, imagine a new ground zero brewing from the 6 million missing decomposing bodies buried under L.A.

Yes yes these theories gets me excited. More stories for the future or the past for KC to tell.



And here's a scientific cross-section of the little-studied Zed Layer:
3145

3146


The worst part of this whole episode was the banter between Saul and Victor...... Too much laughing, Too much reminiscing.......... Someone is going to die shortly and that is sad.......

Ouch you're probably right. I chalked it up to denial and distraction.


Does not explain, why zombocalypse seemed to have started in many different areas nearly simultaneously ... This would require Radon Labs and parnters would have had started shit in different locations at the same time. I am not certain, how to express it. And I may be totally wrong - but am I the only one thinking that the gas is not the 'cause of the zombocalypse, but more kind of a reaction to it?

I struggle because I think there is a vital piece of the puzzle missing.

These are the information I base my doubts on:

a) We know that dead zombies are piled up and eaten by alive zombies. And I think we can at least assume (if not be certain) that Angel, Riley, Michael, Victor, Datu, Samantha, and Saul have encountered piled up zombies at the arena. We also know that at least Victor is negatively affected by the gases. So if the dead and piled up zombies release those gases, then there would be kind of a plot-hole for Victor not showing any symptoms anymore.
Granted: Maybe the gases are released only after a certain while and only if the decompsoing and dissolving zombie-bodies remain untouched for quite a long time while they are kept in a somewhat tight and locked up place. Still: I have doubts, because ...

b) Ground zero was without zombies (except for this single encounter with the Little One), when the gases appeared. And we kind of can be certain that the gases were released through the cracks in the ground. So what, if there were no bodies scattered aroung at/ near ground zero, because the gases dissolved them over the time? Or did I miss descriptions telling us that at ground zeros the streets and places were littered with dead zombie-bodies?
So: Now we have these gases at the Mortuary. Are they there because of the dead bodies, or maybe because the basement has some kind of entry-points for the gases to get into the building?

c) Just a thought: Tanyas zombie-indicators remained low and almost vanished, because she stayed for a prolonged period of time in the Mortuary. Because she is not negatively affected by the gases, the gases might have had an imunizing effect on her and made the z-agent vanish from her body. The same gas might be the reason why the dead zombie-bodies have started to dissolve ...

Please tell me, if I miss an important piece of information here. I look forward to being falsified here ...

Best wishes!
Liam

More reason to have a live show next week. If you guys are up for it I say lets make it happen.

[LiamKerrington]

More reason to have a live show next week. If you guys are up for it I say lets make it happen.

Life show next week? Tell me more!

[Grognaurd]

Liam,

I think Saul's and Victor's first trip to ground zero described uncollected dead. People seemed to have died there, but were not collected like the other five million people in LA

I find it interesting that whatever the gas haze was melted through the body bag. If it was a real body bag, they are designed to contain body rot. Even if it is not, plastic does a good job resisting biology. Was it a strong exothermic reaction (heat) that melted it?

I think we must keep an open mind. It could very well be a chemical gas, but I would not rule out a spore cloud. We could have a fungus that throws spores, infects people, manipulates the host and then converts the host into more spores. I do not like to go too in depth with this stuff. It used to be my day job... But, I will allow myself another piled higher and deeper... Lol

There is a class of microbes that produce methane. It could be possible to harness this process and combine it with the spore life cycle. For dispersal, low density is better. Dandolines put those big pompom hats on to help the wind disperse them. Spores are pretty dense, but what if the microscopic spore had a methane balloon two or three times the size of the spore? It would still be microscopic, and much easier to disperse. We can milk this a bit more and have the spores sit in the methane deep underground and is disturbed by the hydrolic fracking technology that is now being used to vastly increase the amount of natural gas we can pump out of the ground. In real life they are fracking at ground zero.

I can go further down the crazy train, the slime molds normally do there own thing, but when a few of them think the growing conditions suck, they start pumping out a chemical signal to other slime molds to team up and produce spores together. I do not think KC has gone this route, but we have hard science that a single celll microbe can send out a signal that causes them to organize into a multicellular organism. Scifi can take the same concept and push it world wide to have multiple outbreaks.

[katlero]

The worst part of this whole episode was the banter between Saul and Victor...... Too much laughing, Too much reminiscing..........


Someone is going to die shortly and that is sad.......

It's gonna be Saul.... stop denying it!

[Grognaurd]

Redbeard, woodgas is a different process than biodisel. It uses a controlled fire to produce a smoke that can be used in the engine as an explosive gas. I would much rather see them try a woodgas conversion. Not as versatile or power dense as biodiesel, but easier logistics

[Gnex]

It's gonna be Saul.... stop denying it!

hush that talk!!!! Saul will never give up, he will never surrender!!!! :britt:

[katlero]

hush that talk!!!! Saul will never give up, he will never surrender!!!! :britt:

Never gonna let us down.... never gonna run around or desert us?

I do think he will make me cry when we have to say goodbye.


;)

[Gnex]

Every time the into music starts up now I get sad....... :o

[Gnex]

Never gonna let us down.... never gonna run around or desert us?

I do think he will make me cry when we have to say goodbye.


;)

Your just trying to get Saul out of the way so you can have victor all to yourself!!!! Wait.... What?!?!? :squint:

[Litmaster]

Concerning Why Skittles Was Not Munched When Dunbar Fell: <br />
This point, I am admittedly having a hard time with. So we are supposed to believe that, due to his Zombie-Stealth Sweat (and yet...

[Gnex]

We know that Skittles let Ink into Dunbar..... Ink &amp; Co. then spare skittles..... We have seen a few times where Ink has left someone. My thought is there is either something special about the...

[LiamKerrington]

He's got the zombie-agent in his system/ blood. Actually he &quot;is&quot; a zombie, but did not change the way most others did. In fact he may be a smart one, but did not step over the &quot;edge&quot; to become a full...

[MrRedBeard]

Redbeard, woodgas is a different process than biodisel. It uses a controlled fire to produce a smoke that can be used in the engine as an explosive gas. I would much rather see them try a woodgas conversion. Not as versatile or power dense as biodiesel, but easier logistics

Sorry about that I wasn't clear enough. The process of creating Woodgas is very similar to creating methanol plus the process to create methanol is more efficient than woodgas. Lye is sodium hydroxide used in the wash. I'm just saying that eventually stored resources will dwindle and these are two things you will likely end up creating anyways. Sounds like jobs for the colonist that have moved out near the lake.

[LiamKerrington]

Liam,

I think Saul's and Victor's first trip to ground zero described uncollected dead. People seemed to have died there, but were not collected like the other five million people in LA

I find it interesting that whatever the gas haze was melted through the body bag. If it was a real body bag, they are designed to contain body rot. Even if it is not, plastic does a good job resisting biology. Was it a strong exothermic reaction (heat) that melted it?

I think we must keep an open mind. It could very well be a chemical gas, but I would not rule out a spore cloud. We could have a fungus that throws spores, infects people, manipulates the host and then converts the host into more spores. I do not like to go too in depth with this stuff. It used to be my day job... But, I will allow myself another piled higher and deeper... Lol

There is a class of microbes that produce methane. It could be possible to harness this process and combine it with the spore life cycle. For dispersal, low density is better. Dandolines put those big pompom hats on to help the wind disperse them. Spores are pretty dense, but what if the microscopic spore had a methane balloon two or three times the size of the spore? It would still be microscopic, and much easier to disperse. We can milk this a bit more and have the spores sit in the methane deep underground and is disturbed by the hydrolic fracking technology that is now being used to vastly increase the amount of natural gas we can pump out of the ground. In real life they are fracking at ground zero.

I can go further down the crazy train, the slime molds normally do there own thing, but when a few of them think the growing conditions suck, they start pumping out a chemical signal to other slime molds to team up and produce spores together. I do not think KC has gone this route, but we have hard science that a single celll microbe can send out a signal that causes them to organize into a multicellular organism. Scifi can take the same concept and push it world wide to have multiple outbreaks.

#28-3 - No zombies, no living thing, even the dead were brown; that's what Saul states at the start of #28-3. And later, when they reach the target are near/ at ground zero, Saul and Victor observe "blood everywhere" and "a couple of bodys over there. "Rotting bodys were scattered all over." 6:14. And that while there was this "haze" Victor took a picture of with a camera. And there are all "those left over bodies" - at roughly 8:19+. I wonder: bodys of zombies or humans?

And all that months after Kalani and Pegs had their trouble at the area near the end of season #2. I think it is a safe assumption that back then those bodies were there as well. So, consodering the state of the dissolving/ decomposing zombie-body in the Mortuary I have some trouble seeing how the gas has come from the body, because Tanya's body was half as ikd as the bodys at ground zero when Saul and Victor were there.

What next: When Victor and Tanya visit Ground Zero in #40-1 and #40-2 the haze is gone at first and they can breath normally. The bodies were gone, too. But then the haze comes back through a crack in the ground, although there are no dead bodies around on the surface. What does this imply? Either it is true and piles of dead bodys in the underground keep evaporating the gas in unsteady eruptions and it does not matter what's going on on the surface, or the gas has a different source.

In the most recent episode of #46-2 we have this description provided by Tanya:
When Pegs appears, Pegs starts coughing and has trouble breathing the moment the door to the Mortuary is opened.
Then Tanya checks the trays and finds the bodybag of the oldest body in one of the trays. The body bag has melted away, and there was this yellow haze Tanya has recognized in Inglewood.

Ok. Check. The gas comes from the body - probably as kind of a product from the decomposing body of a zombie.

Mh ... That changes my theory in some regards, I guess. Thanks for pointing me towards it.

Best wishes Liam.

[HardKor]

Alright I've got a bit of a :tinfoil: theory here:

The "facts":
Whatever the source of the gas is (either the remains of large numbers of zombie corpses or some sort of other natural deposit) it does seem to be contained underground.
Ink and his army are also located underground.
The gas seems to have a strange quality whereby it can both change humans into zombies but also drives zombies away in large concentrations (since no zombies were seen at ground zero while the haze was there.)

So here's my idea:
What if the haze is not only the cause of the outbreak (possibly) but also the key to defeating Ink. If a large concentration of gas were to be released to flood Ink's tunnels while the zombies are trapped inside (seal up the entrances that Michael, Vic, and Saul are ferreting out) it could kill them. And this could explain why Michael is going back over his journal, he's preparing himself to make a sacrifice by releasing the gas that will trap him as well.

OK you can all take off your :tinfoil:

[Osiris]

:hsugh:

[Storm]

Alright I've got a bit of a :tinfoil: theory here:

The "facts":
Whatever the source of the gas is (either the remains of large numbers of zombie corpses or some sort of other natural deposit) it does seem to be contained underground.
Ink and his army are also located underground.
The gas seems to have a strange quality whereby it can both change humans into zombies but also drives zombies away in large concentrations (since no zombies were seen at ground zero while the haze was there.)

So here's my idea:
What if the haze is not only the cause of the outbreak (possibly) but also the key to defeating Ink. If a large concentration of gas were to be released to flood Ink's tunnels while the zombies are trapped inside (seal up the entrances that Michael, Vic, and Saul are ferreting out) it could kill them. And this could explain why Michael is going back over his journal, he's preparing himself to make a sacrifice by releasing the gas that will trap him as well.

OK you can all take off your :tinfoil:

You know... Now I really want to see Michael dead at the end of the series... :)
Imagine them going Down the tunnels when the gas is gone, finding the corpse of Michael just sitting on the floor leaned up against a wall with his journal in his lap. It would feel quite weird to have him die since he seems to be the main character, but since we've had other points of view it's not really impossible.

[LiamKerrington]

Alright I've got a bit of a :tinfoil: theory here:

The "facts":
Whatever the source of the gas is (either the remains of large numbers of zombie corpses or some sort of other natural deposit) it does seem to be contained underground.
Ink and his army are also located underground.
The gas seems to have a strange quality whereby it can both change humans into zombies but also drives zombies away in large concentrations (since no zombies were seen at ground zero while the haze was there.)

So here's my idea:
What if the haze is not only the cause of the outbreak (possibly) but also the key to defeating Ink. If a large concentration of gas were to be released to flood Ink's tunnels while the zombies are trapped inside (seal up the entrances that Michael, Vic, and Saul are ferreting out) it could kill them. And this could explain why Michael is going back over his journal, he's preparing himself to make a sacrifice by releasing the gas that will trap him as well.

OK you can all take off your :tinfoil:

Mh. Question: the trays in the Mortuary - do they kind of seal of the bodys from the environment? If so, and it looks like that, the gas and the haze evaporate from the dead bodys which were affected by the zombie-agent. It seems to be like a bio-chemical or chemical process going on, although the body of the dead zombie is disfunctional. Unless the zombie-agent is no bacteria, germ or fungus - I think it is neither, but more kind of a chemical cocktail of sorts -, which would survive in an enclosed, almost sealed off, probably kind of cool location, the zombie-agent dissolves the body and releases the gases.

Now, I guess, we need to consider one important detail: from what I understand from Michael's, Victor's and R2Da2's observation, the zombies seemed to have modified/ fortified/ secured the structure of their tunnels with kind of organic stuff - most likely the remains of the dead people and zombies. What, if they used a huge amount of zombie-flesh for this task in the area of Inglewood? Considering the amount of likely zombie-bodies available that would explain why the haze was there for at least three seasons. In season #4 the zombies might have proceded with this task another time (new Little One breeds gone wrong and recycled to become part of the wall of flesh), which let a new haze reappear when Tanya and Victor showed up for some air-samples at ground zero.

Granted: If the zombies have done something like that, the tunnels must have been filled with those gases a lot. Yes. But with those cracks in the ground at Inglewood the gases could dissipate easily - especially, if there are enough open gaps in the system if the tunnels.

Ok. Granted #2: them zombies seem to be affected by the gases as well. Why would they put themselves at such a risk? Good question, which is to be countered by another one: why did the zombies carry away their dead like afrer their war? Their dead bodies had to serve another purpose. Maybe food. Maybe becoming part of the tunnel-system. Maybe becoming a super zombie-gas-chemical bomb underneath LA ...

Best wishes.
Liam

[Vlarken]

Thanks... Now I'm trying to imagine a cross-over between WA and ASOIAF... I guess Michael would be some kind of NW guy... And Saul has finally taken the Black...
I have a feeling wildfire Works pretty well against zombies :D

Ooh, now I'm trying to make Song of Ice and Fire characters into We're Alive and vice-versa too.... Hmm, Riley would be an older Arya. I think Asha Greyjoy would be Scratch. Bricks could be Hodor, lol. Burt could be Lord Commander Mormont. I honestly can't think of any others, but this is fun.

[Storm]

Ooh, now I'm trying to make Song of Ice and Fire characters into We're Alive and vice-versa too.... Hmm, Riley would be an older Arya. I think Asha Greyjoy would be Scratch. Bricks could be Hodor, lol. Burt could be Lord Commander Mormont. I honestly can't think of any others, but this is fun.

Kimmet might be Aerys Targaryen... That mad king guy, can't remember his number, III or IV or something...Pegs and Saul might be wargs, though none of them has ever warged into either Lady or Mr. Whiskers
...
Ooh! Skittles... He just has to be Patchface! :D

[Osiris]

Wondering what any of this has to do with the episode... does it tie in anywhere or are we jumping off track again?

[Verse]

I am. Mainly because the the McGuffin nature of it. Random guy lets Zombies in... and has invisible zombie sweat. Just very odd.

[Verse]

Its been a very musical thread.

This was also a point of discussion on the FanCast. Right there with you on the torture. Riley is starting to parallel Scratch in some ways and makes me agree with Osiris's thoughts from the last thread a bit more about who was the antagonist.


No. Bad RedBeard. Bad. The Prison Inmates are not good guys. Bad RedBeard. Bad.

[Witch_Doctor]

Now, I guess, we need to consider one important detail: from what I understand from Michael's, Victor's and R2Da2's observation, the zombies seemed to have modified/ fortified/ secured the structure of their tunnels with kind of organic stuff - most likely the remains of the dead people and zombies. What, if they used a huge amount of zombie-flesh for this task in the area of Inglewood? Considering the amount of likely zombie-bodies available that would explain why the haze was there for at least three seasons. In season #4 the zombies might have proceded with this task another time (new Little One breeds gone wrong and recycled to become part of the wall of flesh), which let a new haze reappear when Tanya and Victor showed up for some air-samples at ground zero.

Granted: If the zombies have done something like that, the tunnels must have been filled with those gases a lot. Yes. But with those cracks in the ground at Inglewood the gases could dissipate easily - especially, if there are enough open gaps in the system if the tunnels.


Best wishes.
Liam

Bingo! My first thought after hearing Tanya mentioning the gas in the mortuary was that the tunnels are lined with some sort of zombie remains. At first, I thought the gas emitted from the remains build pressure and may have caused some sort of seismic activity, like the local earthquake at Ground Zero around the time the haze reappeared. Hence, the title, "Under Pressure." But that would mean that needs to be corpse-filled tunnels under ground zero, and/or local earthquakes that have yet to be experienced near the tunnels.

[Osiris]

No. Bad RedBeard. Bad. The Prison Inmates are not good guys. Bad RedBeard. Bad.

You don't seem to understand the subtle difference between antagonist and bad guy.

[LiamKerrington]

Wondering what any of this has to do with the episode... does it tie in anywhere or are we jumping off track again?


Nope, it does not.
But it provides evidence that there is at least some activity on this forum.

Best wishes!
Liam

[Osiris]

Nope, it does not.
But it provides evidence that there is at least some activity on this forum.

Best wishes!
Liam

Things have dropped off considerably in the last few months. I can't imagine how anyone could stand to miss such stimulating and topical conversation.

[REZombie]

Sadly havn't had enough time to read the topic, just the first couple pages.....been working too much lately... But anyway..

I still dont understand the hating on B&R for the treatment of Tardust? The man was a useless person before the outbreak, and after it helped the mallers through everything and to top it off he TRIED TO RAPE LIZZY.....I have no sympathy for this man. I personally would put a bullet in his head as soon as i knew where this new spot was, because i would have no further use for him.


Great episode, gonna listen again in the morning and try to get my predictions ready when i'm not about to fall over asleep, lol.

[Storm]

Wondering what any of this has to do with the episode... does it tie in anywhere or are we jumping off track again?


Well, maybe Victor's a huge ASOIAF fan... But no, it's not in any way related to this week's episode, I simply just replied to a post mentioning something from ASOIAF and well... Snowball effect I guess.
...Second thought, Victor doesn't seem to be a guy that reads that many books, so... The only way he could be a fan of it would be from the tv series then, but since WA is taking place in 2009... Grr(m)! Damn it!

[Storm]

Trying to figure out something about the Rainbow fan symbol... Does anyone know whether the five lines come to a point at the top or bottom? My first thought was the top, but if that's not the case.......
Could they represent the five fingers on a hand? It seems to be a quite strong symbol for "stop", which I think an open palm would be too, at least if I have to quote one of the websites I just visited:
"A palm facing outward towards others fends them off or pushes them away in a more obvious way than the palms-down signal ('Stop. Do not come any closer!')."
I don't know what the three arched lines above would be though, maybe they indicate some sort of movement/force/stuff...
If it turns out that they come to a point at the top right below the Rainbow this theory makes no sense... Lol.
Thoughts?

[Merlin1274]

Sadly havn't had enough time to read the topic, just the first couple pages.....been working too much lately... But anyway..

I still dont understand the hating on B&R for the treatment of Tardust? The man was a useless person before the outbreak, and after it helped the mallers through everything and to top it off he TRIED TO RAPE LIZZY.....I have no sympathy for this man. I personally would put a bullet in his head as soon as i knew where this new spot was, because i would have no further use for him.

Its not hate for Tardust's treatment. Its we don't want to see our heroes take the Dark path.. I wish they would draw and quarter him. But to invoke Scratch style torture was what no one wanted to see them do.. Not for the sake of Tardust, but their own sake, Especially Riley..

[Verse]

Trying to figure out something about the Rainbow fan symbol... Does anyone know whether the five lines come to a point at the top or bottom? My first thought was the top, but if that's not the case.......
Could they represent the five fingers on a hand? It seems to be a quite strong symbol for "stop", which I think an open palm would be too, at least if I have to quote one of the websites I just visited:
"A palm facing outward towards others fends them off or pushes them away in a more obvious way than the palms-down signal ('Stop. Do not come any closer!')."
I don't know what the three arched lines above would be though, maybe they indicate some sort of movement/force/stuff...
If it turns out that they come to a point at the top right below the Rainbow this theory makes no sense... Lol.
Thoughts?

I have been googling protection symbols and a hand comes up a lot. You could be on to something.

[Gooer]

Thanks... Now I'm trying to imagine a cross-over between WA and ASOIAF... I guess Michael would be some kind of NW guy... And Saul has finally taken the Black...
I have a feeling wildfire Works pretty well against zombies :D

Someone Fanfic this.

[Gnex]

Things have dropped off considerably in the last few months. I can't imagine how anyone could stand to miss such stimulating and topical conversation.

Agreed!!!! Its like there was some big event or something that turned everyone off to posting on the forums!!! Sucks!!! :meh:

[LiamKerrington]

Agreed!!!! Its like there was some big event or something that turned everyone off to posting on the forums!!! Sucks!!! :meh:

What did I miss?

[Gooer]

Ooh, now I'm trying to make Song of Ice and Fire characters into We're Alive and vice-versa too.... Hmm, Riley would be an older Arya. I think Asha Greyjoy would be Scratch. Bricks could be Hodor, lol. Burt could be Lord Commander Mormont. I honestly can't think of any others, but this is fun.

Would of said Scratch was more a Cersei....... Asha isn't much of a antagonist/evil girl.....

[Osiris]

Agreed!!!! Its like there was some big event or something that turned everyone off to posting on the forums!!! Sucks!!! :meh:

Seemed to begin dropping off when Ft. Irwin became central. It became military chatter, and a lot of people seemed to get bored with it. Military drama/fiction is not everyone's cup of tea, and talking about it is no different. I know that was one of the reason I started posting with less frequency.

[FenixArc]

With a few people mentioning spores/fungus it got me thinking about how Cordyceps works, in real life but more importantly in The Last of Us. In real life, at least one strain of it infects ants and mind controls them for the purpose of infecting even more ants. Interestingly this ties in nicely with theories from earlier in the series that the zombies behave like an ant colony. In the game, people are infected by spores or bites from other infected. After the fungus runs its course, the infected body dies and releases more spores to continue the cycle, perhaps not unlike what is happening in Tanya's morgue.

One of the key elements we are still missing here is how the outbreak started, and in multiple places. If there were already lots of bodies rotting under ground zero, how did they get there, how were they already infected, and how did it happen on other continents?

[Hoff4D]

Yet again, I'm a few episodes behind with regards to the forum and HI AGAIN EVERYBODY!, but I had abandoned/admitted defeat on my theory when we confirmed Datu 'felt compelled' by these symbols. My thoery being that there was some archaic language being used, and that Ink knew something was up long before the outbreak, which is WHY he tattooed himself and was not attacked when found in that van in the video tape we seen (being tattooed with "stop" or "protect". After this week, I'm jumping back on board that train! Now, to look through my post history and try to find when I first made this kooky claim!

And I'm going to try and get back up to speed with the posts asap!

[Vlarken]

Would of said Scratch was more a Cersei....... Asha isn't much of a antagonist/evil girl.....

I was thinking Asha because, while Scratch is a villain, she's also a fighter and pretty fearless. Cersei is just a conniving, pathetic, petty character who, outside of plotting, has no real intelligence. Scratch, as much as I hate to say it, is more than that.

[Gooer]

I was thinking Asha because, while Scratch is a villain, she's also a fighter and pretty fearless. Cersei is just a conniving, pathetic, petty character who, outside of plotting, has no real intelligence. Scratch, as much as I hate to say it, is more than that.

Fair enough. You get some brownie points for that.

[Grognaurd]

Thanks for the info RB, did not realize that you could use wood gas to make methanol. But, I agree with Riley. Biodiesel is a job for Tardust, not Burt.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Hi, though I spent some time about it recently, I think I spent not enough time about finding a solution to the "gas anomaly." I mean, let's suppose that the Ground Zero gas contains a toxic component, the effects of it - as I recall it - seem pretty binary. When being exposed to it, people instantly start coughing and switching their main priority to better get out of here right now. On the other side, we witnessed a lot of zombie corpses lying around when there were not indications whatsoever of them fumigating anything. Moreover, I doubt that there can be a biological component to the gas agent besides the chemical one - just because people did not show signs of an infection after they left or were removed from the emission side.

Besides, as the gas fumigates out of dead bodies, why does it precipitate just at such an occasion and not constantly while the zombie still lived? If it reacted with something inside the zombies body would it not mean the gas is reactive at least? So, if we are dealing with an reactive gas, would it therefor not be likely to be acid or alkaline? Moreover, it is required to have some escharotic quality as well. Surely, I am taking a bold step forward - but damn, why did Tanya not find any traces of this while conducting her blood sample tests? Using reagent paper is no rocket science!

I do not get it.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Yet again, I'm a few episodes behind with regards to the forum and HI AGAIN EVERYBODY!, but I had abandoned/admitted defeat on my theory when we confirmed Datu 'felt compelled' by these symbols. My thoery being that there was some archaic language being used, and that Ink knew something was up long before the outbreak, which is WHY he tattooed himself and was not attacked when found in that van in the video tape we seen (being tattooed with "stop" or "protect". After this week, I'm jumping back on board that train! Now, to look through my post history and try to find when I first made this kooky claim!

And I'm going to try and get back up to speed with the posts asap!

I would like to add one thing here. The episode "Blood, sweat and fears" depicted zombies whose sensory impressions were completely controlled by pheromones after Michael and the others threw some sweat bottles against a wall which the zombies subsequently started to attack. I wonder - if Michael's team captured some regular zombies and would succeed in drenching Ink with human sweat - would the zombies attack Ink or be still repelled by his symbols?

[LiamKerrington]

Hi, though I spent some time about it recently, I think I spent not enough time about finding a solution to the "gas anomaly." I mean, let's suppose that the Ground Zero gas contains a toxic component, the effects of it - as I recall it - seem pretty binary. When being exposed to it, people instantly start coughing and switching their main priority to better get out of here right now. On the other side, we witnessed a lot of zombie corpses lying around when there were not indications whatsoever of them fumigating anything. Moreover, I doubt that there can be a biological component to the gas agent besides the chemical one - just because people did not show signs of an infection after they left or were removed from the emission side.

Besides, as the gas fumigates out of dead bodies, why does it precipitate just at such an occasion and not constantly while the zombie still lived? If it reacted with something inside the zombies body would it not mean the gas is reactive at least? So, if we are dealing with an reactive gas, would it therefor not be likely to be acid or alkaline? Moreover, it is required to have some escharotic quality as well. Surely, I am taking a bold step forward - but damn, why did Tanya not find any traces of this while conducting her blood sample tests? Using reagent paper is no rocket science!

I do not get it.

Damn fine thoughts.

Something to chew on:

What if each zombie releases these gases, but the dosage is so small that you actually do not recognize it. Compare it with "sweating" in a broader sense: you release water from your body 24/7 through your skin; but only when you do sports or are exposed to great heat or use some more recognizable "valves" of your body you actually "see" or "feel" the water flowing. If it is possible to compare this picture with the gases and if the gases are the result of some bio-chemical process within zombie-bodies, then the concentrated appearance of the gases might be the gase, because the gas could gather for some time in a certain spot and then get released - at Ground Zero for example think of the gases gathering and concentrating under the surface, until the pressure opens more gaps or cracks in the ground allowing the gases to get released. Once at the surface the gases spreads so quickly, that the conentration per cubic-foot or cubic-meter decreases, which btw would explain why survivors recognized these gases only in certain areas and not all over LA. In favor of this idea speaks the "obvious": at places where the gas is highly concentrated, there is this haze recognizable; but the farther you are away from it the less likely you "see" the haze or gases, but you may only start reacting to it. Another very good example suporting this is what has been described in #46-2: Pegs reacts to the gas as soon as Tanya opens the door to the Mortuary; but neither Pegs nor Tanya see anything; Tanya gets into the mortuary, still does not see anything, until she opens the tray with the dead body; and here she recognizes the yellow gas or haze like what she saw when she took samples at Ground Zero ...
All a matter of dosage or concentration. And that actually leaves the question open, whether zombies transpire these gases round the clock.

Best wishes!
Liam

[LiamKerrington]

I would like to add one thing here. The episode "Blood, sweat and fears" depicted zombies whose sensory impressions were completely controlled by pheromones after Michael and the others threw some sweat bottles against a wall which the zombies subsequently started to attack. I wonder - if Michael's team captured some regular zombies and would succeed in drenching Ink with human sweat - would the zombies attack Ink or be still repelled by his symbols?

Brilliant idea.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Brilliant idea.

Whatever might be the outcome of this - Inks gonna be pissed off big time. So it appears to be worth a try. :D Just for giggles.

[Footbutt]

"Under Pressure" could mean "more gas is about to be released" ?

Zombie farts are toxic, too.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

BTW, will Puck play a vital role in the episodes to come? He seems to be rather incapacitated for the foreseeable future...

http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/DSCN22531.jpg

[Grognaurd]

Whatever might be the outcome of this - Inks gonna be pissed off big time. So it appears to be worth a try. :D Just for giggles.

I think they might have to throw paint or put a bag over Ink's head. Yea, the biters do smell, but his tattoos might give conflicting direction.

[Grognaurd]

BTW, will Puck play a vital role in the episodes to come? He seems to be rather incapacitated for the foreseeable future...

http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/DSCN22531.jpg

As Saul says in Chapter 1, "Let's go out with a BANG!"

He can ride and direct KODI (spelling?) right to Ink, just like Slim Pickens...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcW_Ygs6hm0&feature

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

As Saul says in Chapter 1, "Let's go out with a BANG!"

He can ride and direct KODI (spelling?) right to Ink, just like Slim Pickens...

I see...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJH9yvGJnb0

[Footbutt]

Combat Operation(s) Deployment Initiative
CODI

(at least, i'm pretty sure...)

[kent17]

Combat Operation(s) Deployment Initiative
CODI

(at least, i'm pretty sure...)

Close, I had to look it up, I was pretty sure is started with killing

Killing Ordnance Deployment Initiative

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Brilliant idea.

Well, with all the different kind of sweats, Michael, Vic and Saul have a complete arsenal of weapons at their disposal on the current mission.

Du-du-duuuh. Just sayin'.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ee/B-52H_static_display_arms_06.jpg/800px-B-52H_static_display_arms_06.jpg

[Gnex]

COWDI

It's KODI being pulled by Mrs. Magoo!!!!!

[LiamKerrington]

Whatever might be the outcome of this - Inks gonna be pissed off big time. So it appears to be worth a try. :D Just for giggles.

I am looking forward to this soooooooo much!

[LiamKerrington]

Combat Operation(s) Deployment Initiative
CODI

(at least, i'm pretty sure...)

Nope. In #33-1 it gets introduced and explained:


Killing Ordnance Deployment Initiative

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ T H I S ^ ^ ^ ^ ^

[qreepii]

Edit some one already posted my point.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Again, this is totally unrelated to the latest topics discussed here but: Hooray to a show which has given us 43 minutes of chapter 46 thus far without any commercials. Do not get me wrong on this, I do mind the commercials as they are essential to run the show. I just like to point out that I really like - and appreciate - the effort and dedication that is put in WA by the whole production team. Thank you.

[LiamKerrington]

Edit some one already posted my point.

Which was ... what ... ?

[Witch_Doctor]

We know that Skittles let Ink into Dunbar..... Ink & Co. then spare skittles..... We have seen a few times where Ink has left someone. My thought is there is either something special about the people that Ink leaves, or....... Ink being a scientist before the outbreak, still has a scientific mindset and wants to leave certain people to see how they react, etc, etc..... Skittles and Puck and CJ were all left after almost everyone around them had been killed......

Lets list the one's he has spared.

Duncan
C.J.
Kalani
Riley
Puck

Any common thread?

[Gnex]

Lets list the one's he has spared.

Duncan
C.J.
Kalani
Riley
Puck

Any common thread?

Kalani is the rare one in the bunch.............

Basically at some point he was capture, held in the Arena...... and for all intents and purposes was going to become a sacrifice to the baby little ones like Samantha........

However, later on when Kalani and Riley are caught at Cain Hospital, Ink snatches and arrow out of mid air, laughs at them...... and "technically" lets them go........ Granted they are still attacked, but not by Ink.


Sooo..... what happened between the first time Kalani was caught and the second???

[Gooer]

Sooo..... what happened between the first time Kalani was caught and the second???

Maybe it was because he managed to escape the first time that he let him live, as Ink thought he was special, maybe?

[LiamKerrington]

Lets list the one's he has spared.

Duncan
C.J.
Kalani
Riley
Puck

Any common thread?

Even if unwillingly, he also spared:
Michael, Angel, Saul and Burt. They encountered him. Ink tried to attack them, but was downed. So he fled.

But more interestingly: Why did Ink knock against Burt's door in the Tower instead of following the scent left by all the Towerites? Hi did not chase or attack them. So - kind of - he left them, too.
But what was it that attracted his attention to Burt's armory?


However, later on when Kalani and Riley are caught at Cain Hospital, Ink snatches and arrow out of mid air, laughs at them...... and "technically" lets them go........ Granted they are still attacked, but not by Ink.
And this, too!

=> These leads me to the assumption that "something" maybe be different with the people from the Tower.
Best wishes!
Liam

[LiamKerrington]

Even if unwillingly, he also spared:
Michael, Angel, Saul and Burt. They encountered him. Ink tried to attack them, but was downed. So he fled.

But more interestingly: Why did Ink knock against Burt's door in the Tower instead of following the scent left by all the Towerites? Hi did not chase or attack them. So - kind of - he left them, too.
But what was it that attracted his attention to Burt's armory?


And this, too!

=> These leads me to the assumption that "something" maybe be different with the people from the Tower.
Best wishes!
Liam

P.S.: A stretch. In think.

[Witch_Doctor]

Maybe it was because he managed to escape the first time that he let him live, as Ink thought he was special, maybe?

Someone mentioned, on a different thread, that they thought Ink might spare those who have survived his minions' attacks. They included Kalani, Riley, C.J., and possibly Puck (depends on when the post was written) as examples.

[Grognaurd]

Not quite the same thing, but Ink did not attack Lizzy, Saul and Burt at the Ambush site in the rain. He observed them from a rooftop about 100 meters away.

Something else that is significantly different. Both The Tower and Dunbar armored their vehicles. Latch & Scratch cruise around LA in a convertible ( I presume with the top down ) without or low on Ammo. The next day, Latch, does shoot Charlie. So, this begs the question, why go without ammo the day before, or where did they use it before running into Burt, Lizzy and Saul?

Last, the big one at the jail chases Puck outside, but then attacks the new gun truck built at Dunbar. Presumably used heavily by Victor, CJ and Saul.

[Witch_Doctor]

Even if unwillingly, he also spared:
Michael, Angel, Saul and Burt. They encountered him. Ink tried to attack them, but was downed. So he fled.
But more interestingly: Why did Ink knock against Burt's door in the Tower instead of following the scent left by all the Towerites? Hi did not chase or attack them. So - kind of - he left them, too.
But what was it that attracted his attention to Burt's armory?
And this, too!
=> These leads me to the assumption that "something" maybe be different with the people from the Tower.
Best wishes!
Liam

It's hard to tell, but I think that Ink was banging on a different apartment door. Even if he wasn't, the apartment he was trying to enter was occupied. As Burt, Micheal and Saul reach that floor they determine that the sound is coming from around the corner. When asked where his apartment is, Burt says that it is around the corner at the end, east-facing. When they turn the corner, they see Ink banging on the door near the end of the hall.

While they are arguing over what to do, Burt says that his apartment is on the other side of Ink. Ink points to the floor above them when asked where the survivors are (What an honest guy. That's rare during the Apocalypse) while he tries to enter an apartment. After Pegs arrive, she tells them that most of the survivors hid upstairs but a few were in the room where Ink was trying to enter. After entering Burt's place and discovering the ammo missing Saul asks Pegs where were the others, and she says that some of us were in the apartment that ink was trying to get into. She didn't say, "Some of us were in here." which is what she would have said if they were hiding in Burt's apartment. They discuss the missing ammo and food when it is pointed out that a key is needed to enter his place.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Someone mentioned, on a different thread, that they thought Ink might spare those who have survived his minions' attacks. They included Kalani, Riley, C.J., and possibly Puck (depends on when the post was written) as examples.

Valid point. But this would also wipe out Ink's chances of becoming a James Bond villian because the sterotypical Bond villian sends his minions to liquidate in the first movie hour before he (or she: do not forget Sophie Marceau!) tries to kill Bond by him-/herself.

[Witch_Doctor]

Not quite the same thing, but Ink did not attack Lizzy, Saul and Burt at the Ambush site in the rain. He observed them from a rooftop about 100 meters away.

Something else that is significantly different. Both The Tower and Dunbar armored their vehicles. Latch & Scratch cruise around LA in a convertible ( I presume with the top down ) without or low on Ammo. The next day, Latch, does shoot Charlie. So, this begs the question, why go without ammo the day before, or where did they use it before running into Burt, Lizzy and Saul?

Last, the big one at the jail chases Puck outside, but then attacks the new gun truck built at Dunbar. Presumably used heavily by Victor, CJ and Saul.

The fact that Latch and Scratch travel about, seemingly, without a care always bugs me. They even travel to the Tower alone, at night. Burt or Micheal says they were scoping out the place, and later when Ink arrives, Ink seems to KNOW how to keep his back to the camera.

What also bugs me is when Kalani was at Dunbar. As Ink and his minion invade the tower, Scratch tells Kalani that the invasion of Dunbar wasn't good enough, he'll find away and he better start running. What's that all about? Is she scoping human's for Ink to harvest?

[Witch_Doctor]

Valid point. But this would also wipe out Ink's chances of becoming a James Bond villian because the sterotypical Bond villian sends his minions to liquidate in the first movie hour before he (or she: do not forget Sophie Marceau!) tries to kill Bond by him-/herself.

Ahhh, not necessarily, my friend. I'm sure Ink has some sort of elaborate, overly complex execution plan involving the tunnels for our heroes' demise.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xAMYHJYesM

[Gooer]

Someone mentioned, on a different thread, that they thought Ink might spare those who have survived his minions' attacks. They included Kalani, Riley, C.J., and possibly Puck (depends on when the post was written) as examples.

That does makes a lot of sense. Let the strong survive/survival of the fittest.

But then, if he did let the strong survive, wouldn't it be easier for humans to defeat him? Hmm.....

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Ahhh, not necessarily, my friend. I'm sure Ink has some sort of elaborate, overly complex execution plan involving the tunnels for our heroes' demise

Speaking of which, I hope he remembered to set up some nice traps, too.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arMXzgiZsJQ

[Grognaurd]

The fact that Latch and Scratch travel about, seemingly, without a care always bugs me. They even travel to the Tower alone, at night. B?

Yea, the mass attacks do seem to have a nighttime or rainstorm bias. Not perfect correlation, but...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B436avtEXzs&feature

[Gooer]

Not quite the same thing, but Ink did not attack Lizzy, Saul and Burt at the Ambush site in the rain. He observed them from a rooftop about 100 meters away.

Something else that is significantly different. Both The Tower and Dunbar armored their vehicles. Latch & Scratch cruise around LA in a convertible ( I presume with the top down ) without or low on Ammo. The next day, Latch, does shoot Charlie. So, this begs the question, why go without ammo the day before, or where did they use it before running into Burt, Lizzy and Saul?

Last, the big one at the jail chases Puck outside, but then attacks the new gun truck built at Dunbar. Presumably used heavily by Victor, CJ and Saul.

Pretty sure Ink DID attack Saul, Lizzy and Burt, he was just observing them until they noticed that Ink was watching them. Although, on the other hand, he could of just attacked them in retaliation to being shot at.....

Otherwise, those are some interesting points.....

[Witch_Doctor]

Pretty sure Ink DID attack Saul, Lizzy and Burt, he was just observing them until they noticed that Ink was watching them. Although, on the other hand, he could of just attacked them in retaliation to being shot at.....

Otherwise, those are some interesting points.....

Yeah, after they shot at Ink, he called others. This was the first appearance of the Runners (Super Fasties in Skittilish)

[Zealous2]

I was thinking maybe the Nike Swoosh on Skittles t-shirt is a protection symbol, not his sweat?
Could be trouble for the "lathered up" group.

Also, this is LA. I'm sure there is a few companies with armored stretch limos and there own car service centre with fuel pumps. Maybe even those stretch HumVee limos. Wouldn't they be good vehicles for patrolling the non blocked streets?

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

One last "motivation" song for Tardust - keep on running:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULzoxl7J_3g

[Grognaurd]

Yeah, after they shot at Ink, he called others. This was the first appearance of the Runners (Super Fasties in Skittilish)

Yea, I should have been more clear. Usually we see attack first. This is pretty clearly retaliatory. If he ambushed them with the runners I am pretty sure at least one would have been caught. I guess KC forgot to include a redshirt. Not really sure how that happened since Michael hates odd numbers in the field.

In my alternate :tinfoil: We're Alive universe, I always figured Lizzy was connected to Ink through psychotherapy. He recognizes her and does not attack. Later, I figure she is hiding in the apartment that he is knocking on and I also found it interesting that whatever calming affect she had on Ink is Trumped by the appearance of Angel.

Of course, then I get stuck in a thought feedback spiral because Angel seems to elicit attack and Latch & Scratch do not.

[Grognaurd]

Ruh-Roh Shaggy!

So, just started to relisten to this chapter. CJ says she labeled the bottles. Not the way I would have done it. Labels require light to read. Bad news on a covert op. even worse underground. I would use different shaped bottles so one can tell the difference by feel in the dark

Also, bad sector of fire disciplin when they see the three biters. Sound like they are all captivated. That's about the time one becomes ambushed from another direction. We need Puck the enforcer!

[UndeadSweeper]

Ruh-Roh Shaggy!

So, just started to relisten to this chapter. CJ says she labeled the bottles. Not the way I would have done it. Labels require light to read. Bad news on a covert op. even worse underground. I would use different shaped bottles so one can tell the difference by feel in the dark

Also, bad sector of fire disciplin when they see the three biters. Sound like they are all captivated. That's about the time one becomes ambushed from another direction. We need Puck the enforcer!

Hmm, this could lead to a very intensive game of Red light, green light. :)

They just slightly ajar the bottle for a moment and see if the come toward them.

[Witch_Doctor]

Yea, I should have been more clear. Usually we see attack first. This is pretty clearly retaliatory.

Yeah, that is what I thought you meant. He attacked after they shot at him.

In my alternate :tinfoil: We're Alive universe, I always figured Lizzy was connected to Ink through psychotherapy. He recognizes her and does not attack. Later, I figure she is hiding in the apartment that he is knocking on and I also found it interesting that whatever calming affect she had on Ink is Trumped by the appearance of Angel.

Of course, then I get stuck in a thought feedback spiral because Angel seems to elicit attack and Latch & Scratch do not.

Same here. I thought her psychology degree would come into play. Also, the GREEN EYES. Both of them have green eyes.

[Grognaurd]

Yeah, that is what I thought you meant. He attacked after they shot at him.


Same here. I thought her psychology degree would come into play. Also, the GREEN EYES. Both of them have green eyes.

Yea, Ink, Samantha and Lizzy all with green eyes. Hope may also. Heck, I even linked Nick and Nicholas