Has Scratch cut a deal?

[peterw]

Is it possible that Scratch has made some kind of a deal with Inky?

I know she kind of went maternal with Lizzy, but this maternal instinct made her go and cut Burt's finger off to get information.... why?

My theory is that she agreed to hand over the baby to Inky unless she can get info on where Michael and Co went.

Why would the zombies want a baby? They can't reproduce. They are making better version of themselves, but only from living parts, and once all of the people are gone, they will die out.

So in this vein, anyone know what the zombie noises in the background are when Scratch and Tardust are walking around in episode 24? Why aren't the biters attacking them? Are they on a roof or something? Or are they in cahoots?

Notice they (Inky and co) only attacked the colony after the mallers got out... interesting yeah?

Shoot me down guys :)

[turbo]

Haha good theory! In 24 they had their own people defending them while they were talking I assume.

And technically they do reproduce with a little bite!

[nikvoodoo]

Lets log in and see what's going on in ye olden forum!


They can't reproduce. They are making better version of themselves, but only from living parts


grah!!! FRANKENZOMBIE THEORY!!!!!

(ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ ┻━┻

[Osiris]

Nik's gone again. Guess that leaves StepLaugh in charge of this until . . . oh wait . . . he's gone too. Shit. If that means I'm in charge then . . .

[peterw]

Haha good theory! In 24 they had their own people defending them while they were talking I assume.

Yeah I guess that's right, but some of those zombie growls seemed really near with no one shooting them. Scratch shoots one, but not anymore... can't work that bit out.


.. technically they do reproduce with a little bite!
Yep but they need a human to start with, they can't reproduce without a human... that's what I meant

Notice also, that the zombies started guarding the tower, without attacking just before Scratch showed up.

And Durai didn't seems to care about Lizzy at all, only Scratch. Now this could all be down to the maternal thing... but maybe not.

[Litmaster]

http://www.footjoy.com/community/cfs-file.ashx/__key/CommunityServer.Discussions.Components.Files/22/4214.caddy-shack.jpg

"Oooh, my arm! It's broken!"

[Witch_Doctor]

There are things that support or weaken your suggestion.

Scratch and the Mallers seem comfortable traveling at night.

Latch and Scratch's first visit to the tower.
When Saul was attacked in the hybrid, he heard voices. Mallers? CJ survivors?


Lizzy says that Pinstripes seemed to know that he was being watched so he kept his face away from the camera in Chapter 11.
Earlier Latch and Scratch cased the Tower's lobby.
When CJ's tower is under attack Scratch seemed nonchalant when Kalani told her.

Almost like she knew or expected the attack to be under way.
CJ's tower attacked 3 days after Scratch sends Kalani.
Ink attacks Tower 3(?) days after Latch and Scratch's visit.

Ink's minion does attack Scratch's convoy on the way to attack the arena. Ink is seen there too.

[Malador]

Don't forget the hospital, where even though he was attacked he made no move against Riley, who was with Scratch's spy Kalani.

[peterw]

Don't forget the hospital, were even though he was attacked he made no move against Riley, who was with Scratch's spy Kalani.

Excellent point.

[peterw]

There are things that support or weaken your suggestion.

Scratch and the Mallers seem comfortable traveling at night.

Latch and Scratch's first visit to the tower.
When Saul was attacked in the hybrid, he heard voices. Mallers? CJ survivors?


Lizzy says that Pinstripes seemed to know that he was being watched so he kept his face away from the camera in Chapter 11.
Earlier Latch and Scratch cased the Tower's lobby.
When CJ's tower is under attack Scratch seemed nonchalant when Kalani told her.

Almost like she knew or expected the attack to be under way.
CJ's tower attacked 3 days after Scratch sends Kalani.
Ink attacks Tower 3(?) days after Latch and Scratch's visit.



Wow, very in depth. Yes good points


There are things that support or weaken your suggestion.
Ink's minion does attack Scratch's convoy on the way to attack the arena. Ink is seen there too.
[/LIST]
Yeah, I was thinking about this one too. It's possible that they did this because it was Durai's call, or maybe there are factions of zombies that are against each other in some way, but you are right it does weaken my theory.

Or... does it... just thought, that convoy was ambushed... how did they know to set an ambush?... no on reflection that doesn't work. She wouldn't plan an ambush and then carry out the attack when she was offered the chance to retreat.

[LiamKerrington]

Hi there,


Is it possible that Scratch has made some kind of a deal with Inky?

I know she kind of went maternal with Lizzy, but this maternal instinct made her go and cut Burt's finger off to get information.... why?

My theory is that she agreed to hand over the baby to Inky unless she can get info on where Michael and Co went.

Why would the zombies want a baby? They can't reproduce. They are making better version of themselves, but only from living parts, and once all of the people are gone, they will die out.

So in this vein, anyone know what the zombie noises in the background are when Scratch and Tardust are walking around in episode 24? Why aren't the biters attacking them? Are they on a roof or something? Or are they in cahoots?

Notice they (Inky and co) only attacked the colony after the mallers got out... interesting yeah?

Shoot me down guys :)

now, if things turn out that way, then Scratch would be even more f*cked up than I have imagined up until now.

About the baby-delivery-deal: No, I have some trouble accepting the idea. When Scratch realized the pregnancy of Lizzy's it was right before she and the Mallers went out to "nuke" the Arena with a shitload of tanker-rigs and bombs ... Considering that back then the Arena was under Ink's control, it would be kind of odd that Scratch would have a deal on the one hand, but would be willing and loving to send the place back to hell.

But we don't know what has happened afterwards. And still: After the Arena-blast the Mallers went straight to the South in order to take over the Colony. Here, too, I have some trouble believing that during this time Scratch would keep up or establich a deal with Ink.

Why would the zombs wonna have babies? Well - for breeding Little Ones, like what they did in chapter #10 (arguable).

The Burt torturing has nothing to do with Lizzy's little Henry; it has a lot more to do with Scratch's revenge; and Scratch hoped to learn from Burt where the cowards fled to.

And finally about the zombonoises in chapter #24: Scratch and her crew were on top of a building and thus out of range of zombies; although it was not mentioned it is quite safe to assume that the Mallers took care to secure their position in order to be able to attack the Tower and not get into trouble again like what has happened in The War. That's why you hear zombies around w/o Scratch and Tardust did not care 'bout 'em rotten freaks.

Best wishes!
Liam

[LiamKerrington]

Ink's minion does attack Scratch's convoy on the way to attack the arena. Ink is seen there too.

Very good point and probably the strongest argument why there would be know deal between Ink and Scratch.

[LiamKerrington]

Or... does it... just thought, that convoy was ambushed... how did they know to set an ambush?... no on reflection that doesn't work. She wouldn't plan an ambush and then carry out the attack when she was offered the chance to retreat.

Them zombs have smart ones and maybe a still unknown breed who observe the whole area. Having a convoy of cars and trucks driving around might launch activities on the side of them zombs. The zombs would "understand" (smart ones) what possible routes such a convoi would take and then, at the right place, block roads in order to lead a convoy into a trap. We know that this happened in the past - CJ's convoy and the remains which were found by Lizzy, Saul, and Burt - with normal cars which were able to go faster then rigs - especially through streets filled with dead cars and debris.
And why would zombs do this? a) Get more food; b) limit the 'power' of their 'enemies' (humans) by leaving a number of (important) cars and guns out in the wild and out of reach of other survivors ...
So, yes: them zombs are capable of doing so ...

Ink seemed to coordinate attacks on convoys. If he and Scratch had a deal, then wouldn't he have recognized her during the ambush on the truck, and wouldn't he have stopped the ambush then? At least he did not stop the ambush, and it was only a mixture of skill, luck, and maybe the huge number of involved Mallers that most of them got out of the trap without harm ...

[Malador]

I still wonder why he let both CJ and Riley/Kalani go. Maybe he knows certain people are going to draw others to them, and he lets them go so they do the work of gathering survivors to them, and he doesn't have to exhaust so many resources trying to find small groups.

[LiamKerrington]

I still wonder why he let both CJ and Riley/Kalani go. Maybe he knows certain people are going to draw others to them, and he lets them go so they do the work of gathering survivors to them, and he doesn't have to exhaust so many resources trying to find small groups.

This was part of some of the discussions in the past ... And we still don't have a clear depiction of what might be the reason for this strange behavior.

I am not so certain about "exhausting" his ressources; considering the "army" that was and is available to Ink what are a couple of losses to kill a powerful enemy?
I would ask this: Would it be possible that Ink realizes "the strong" within the ranks of his enemies - CJ, Riley and Kalani - and expects them to gather others around them? This would imply a simple logic - a strict hierarchical thinking like this: "I let you live in order to 'allow' you to gather a group around you; and then we will meet again."

This btw. would actually be kind of "in line" with the season #4 picture mentioned on the other thread - Ink the puppeteer, even controlling his enemies along what Ink actually wants ... o_O

What would be the point in such a way of thinking? If Ink allows certain "alpha"-people to gather people around them he makes them the shepherds for his future food and allows him and his horde to save time and effort to go out hunting others as well. Just consider this: Nearly from the beginning on often the organized zombs have attacked groups of people in an organized fashion - the Tower, Dunbar, the convoys, now the Colony. True - on the first day it was a full mayhem on any level; but soon after that things calmed down the attacks of zombies were either kind of accidental (a survivor meets a zomb ...) or very well organized or planed ... And it was always Ink who made a conscious decision by 'saving' CJ or Riley and Kalani. And the more I think of it the more I think it is all about accepting them as strong survivors being capable of gathering more zombie-food and thus exploiting them in his and his horde's favor ...
(All this is very arguable ...)

Best wishes!
Liam

[peterw]

Hmmm. Yes I think my theory is dead, or at least it no longer has any sensible supporting arguments.
I agree, it doesn't make sense that there would be a deal and an attack on the rink at the same time and Ink does seem to be the main guy at the rink.

Yes, if there was a deal then the attack on the convoy doesn't make sense does it.

Oh well. It's sad when a pet theory dies isn't it...

It's really cool that there is a group of people who seriously think about this stuff!!

Didn't know they were on a building in chapter 24. How did you know that?

[LiamKerrington]

Hey deer_in_the-Headlights,


Hmmm. Yes I think my theory is dead, or at least it no longer has any sensible supporting arguments.
I agree, it doesn't make sense that there would be a deal and an attack on the rink at the same time and Ink does seem to be the main guy at the rink.

Oh well. It's sad when a pet theory dies isn't it...

It's really cool that there is a group of people who seriously think about this stuff!!

Didn't know they were on a building in chapter 24. How did you know that?

please don't worry. It is theories like yours and of the many around that make We're Alive so amazingly awesome. There are so many vague information available that you really can deeply dive into the theory-frail in this awesome story. And I agree with you: That's pretty darn COOL.

How do I know about the building: Well, there are several mentionings within chapter #24 that make me think so:
- 08:49 - something on the building North of the Tower
- 18:43 - Where are they shooting from? North-side rooftops (referring to the RPG shots)
- 22:30 - the ground is littered with those "things" (i.e. zombs) out there => so no Mallers on the ground
- 26:35 - "We have a perfect exit all around us."; that's what Scratch answers to Tardust; what does she mean? The free open ranges between buildings? Then they would be easy game for the Tower-people. Or a building with several entrances?
- 27:21 - "Check our exits ... Get our .. drivers ready." - Does Scratch 'describe' the exits of a huge parging-garage, so kind of a building instead of a free parking lot? Or is it something like the garage within a building like what we have with the Tower?
- 34:25 - Scratch refers to the enemy "out there"; does she imply that at that particular moment she is "in somewhere", like in a building?
-

Something, though, may contradict my conclusions: At 23:39 a zomb shows up and Scratch kills it before she speaks with Tardust about Puck and the truck; now, from where did she shoot it? And if the ground is littered with the zombies, why was no immediate reaction to her shot by several/ many other zombs? Maybe, because shot from a 'superior' position - like from a second or third floor near the exit of a building leading to the truck? Who knows? The story won't tell us ...
And 27:05 ... Is that a car-door slamming? If so, where would they (Scratch, Tardust, Lizzy) be? Maybe on a parking deck? Or outside a building on the street?
Then 35:42 - Saul's "shootin' the hell out of 'em" ... So, Saul and Victor are in the Hummer with the 50 cal; and he shoots at the Mallers - which ones? Victor points to the ones on the roof-top and others in trucks ... What does this tell about the exact position of Scratch and Tardust?

In the end it looks like the Mallers are scattered in several groups; and in some way they need to be "safe" from the "things" littering the ground. So, in my opinion, they are or were somewhere more safe then just within cars on the street.
Just a matter of conclusion and opinion. So no, I don't know facts.

Best wishes!
Liam

[Witch_Doctor]

Wow, very in depth. Yes good points


Yeah, I was thinking about this one too. It's possible that they did this because it was Durai's call, or maybe there are factions of zombies that are against each other in some way, but you are right it does weaken my theory.

Or... does it... just thought, that convoy was ambushed... how did they know to set an ambush?... no on reflection that doesn't work. She wouldn't plan an ambush and then carry out the attack when she was offered the chance to retreat.

So many rings! The attack wasn't entirely successful, they lost a rig and one was diverted to be used on the tower (unless it was a spare for fuel purposes)
After the bombing of the arena when Lizzy drops the recorder, a TALKING zombie picks it up, sniffs it and says to others, "go!" Shortly afterwards, Tanya is snatched by Randy and some burned zombies. (Now I can't remember why I thought this my be connected to Scratch O_o)

Speculations below.
Wait, she made the attack because Durai is in control but purposefully failed at it.
She didn't want CJ's tower (against Durai) but used Kalani to find it and lead Pinstripes there.
She didn't want The Tower (against Durai), thus provoking a war where Pinstripes failed another attempt at invading the Tower.
Has kept the Mallers relatively safe from the Zs?
She does seem to be like a Baltar-like character from the Original Battlestar Galactica series.

[Witch_Doctor]

This was part of some of the discussions in the past ... And we still don't have a clear depiction of what might be the reason for this strange behavior.

Would it be possible that Ink realizes "the strong" within the ranks of his enemies - CJ, Riley and Kalani - and expects them to gather others around them? This would imply a simple logic - a strict hierarchical thinking like this: "I let you live in order to 'allow' you to gather a group around you; and then we will meet again."
If Ink allows certain "alpha"-people to gather people around them he makes them the shepherds for his future food and allows him and his horde to save time and effort to go out hunting others as well. Just consider this: Nearly from the beginning on often the organized zombs have attacked groups of people in an organized fashion - the Tower, Dunbar, the convoys, now the Colony. True - on the first day it was a full mayhem on any level; but soon after that things calmed down the attacks of zombies were either kind of accidental (a survivor meets a zomb ...) or very well organized or planed ... And it was always Ink who made a conscious decision by 'saving' CJ or Riley and Kalani. And the more I think of it the more I think it is all about accepting them as strong survivors being capable of gathering more zombie-food and thus exploiting them in his and his horde's favor ...
(All this is very arguable ...)

Best wishes!
Liam

Very good point, also allowing the arena to be partially destroyed would cut down on a sizable Z population competing for food. I read about an artificial neural network experiment that simulated a naval battle. The neural net would sink some of its own ships in order to improve the mobility of its other ships.

[Witch_Doctor]

Hey deer_in_the-Headlights,
How do I know about the building: Well, there are several mentionings within chapter #24 that make me think so
- 08:49 - something on the building North of the Tower
- 18:43 - Where are they shooting from? North-side rooftops (referring to the RPG shots)
- 22:30 - the ground is littered with those "things" (i.e. zombs) out there => so no Mallers on the ground
- 26:35 - "We have a perfect exit all around us."; that's what Scratch answers to Tardust; what does she mean? The free open ranges between buildings? Then they would be easy game for the Tower-people. Or a building with several entrances?
- 27:21 - "Check our exits ... Get our .. drivers ready." - Does Scratch 'describe' the exits of a huge parging-garage, so kind of a building instead of a free parking lot? Or is it something like the garage within a building like what we have with the Tower?
- 34:25 - Scratch refers to the enemy "out there"; does she imply that at that particular moment she is "in somewhere", like in a building?
-
Best wishes!
Liam

And THIS is how Liam goes Sherlock Holmes! :)

[LiamKerrington]

Hi there,

Witch_Doctor: If this will ever occur that your country and my country get into a war, I so much hope you are not part of the tacticians planning my country's defeat ... We'd be lost! Awesome ...!

This would be so amazing to learn that Ink and Scratch arranged something or that Scratch unknowingly became a puppet of Ink's and that he let her destroy one of his bases, and masses of his food-devouring deadheads (pun intended ...) - and all this because WD is the CPU of Ink's network ... ! :zombieglomp:

Best wishes!
Liam

[Witch_Doctor]

LiamKerrington, with you on the other side it would be the stalest of stalemates. But, I'd have to sit out that war. I've adopted Germany as my heimat away from home, most beautiful place I've ever been.

But this is just pure genius, keeping strong leaders to draw in crowds, then attack. Keeping his own population in check. Controlling Zs and people. Puppet master indeed.
Scratch seems to be the strings.

Has she ever been attacked personally? She seems psychopathic. Never seems afraid of the Zs. Certainly doesn't keep her voice down. I was half expecting her to eat Burt's finger and reveal herself to be the highest functioning Smart Z.

[peterw]

Hmm. Thanks guys. I'm leaning away from this but it seems that its possible there could be something going on here.

[Malador]

I'm listening to chapter 27 again, and apparently Ink also gave Duncan/Skittles a pass, since he says "They got everyone, and I was right there. I was right there, and they never looked at me."

[LiamKerrington]

I'm listening to chapter 27 again, and apparently Ink also gave Duncan/Skittles a pass, since he says "They got everyone, and I was right there. I was right there, and they never looked at me."

Reminds me of them zombs in WWZ ignoring the sick and ill humans ... Coincidence?
Or is it the special will of survival Duncan/ Skittles which Ink recognized and which is why Ink saved him?
Now a crackpot: What, if it is true and Ink IS Bill Roberts, the guy with the mental health background; what, if Ink recognized a "like-minded" brother on the side of the humans, because Skittles has a certain'edge' to his (new) personailty, and therefore developed a certain sympathy for him which made him spare Skittles' life?

Best wishes!
Liam

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

Scratch - a servant of Ink? Seriously? I am having a hard time believing that. Please do not get me wrong here, it is still possible but in my opinion not very likely. Season 4 should not be a game of alliance dominoes. There is definitely a thin red line between a genuine storyline and a plot twist bombardment just for the sake of suspense. So please, no another Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Degrees_of_Kevin_Bacon) game.

[Grognaurd]

What is the Tell?

There has to be a give away for Scratch to go from Tardust can abuse Lizzy any way he wants to do not touch her ever again. All I am left with is Smell. Her vomit gags Tardust and Bricks. Scratch does not seem to mind. Saul is not troubled by the barf bag. He simply says someone lost their lunch when he finds Lizzy's shoulder bag.

So, let's leverage smell. They break the first sweat vial or two and nothing happens. The crew jumps to the conclusion that it is not enough so they break all of them and tahdah, the zombies come. Like a good scientist Lizzy keeps the sweat separate, to see if the zombies are attracted to someone in particular. This information is lost when they break them all. Going back to the breaking of the first vial or to, maybe the zombies do not care about the first two people... It is not more is needed, it is they may only be interested in certain people.

More or a certain person. We cannot rule either out.

Where else can we leverage smell? It is probably nothing, but Saul tell Angel you smell worse than usual on the night of the war, right? At least i thnk it was Saul. Earlier that night a drunken Burt says, Angel is puking in the bathroom.

Going further back to when Lizzy figures out the car trap we find out they smell like shit. Probably nothing again, probably just simple hygiene in the Apocolypse, but I think Puck says you smell like shit Sarge, when they get to Irwin and doesn't he say something similar to Saul, Vic and Lizzy at the reunion at the colony at the end of Season 3? No love, you all stink any way or something like that