The First Born

[Osiris]

The last chapter got me thinking... who is knocked up? Will there be a 'First Born' in Season Three? Is it Pegs?! What do you think that the first child will do to the residents of the Tower? Will it give them even more reason to fight? Will it raise morale overall? Will there be jealous men and women? Does the First Born only bring false hopes to the survivors? Far too many questions beyond that, but I think this is a good enough start.

In my gut I'm leaning towards Pegs being pregnant, First Born introduced in either the first chapter of season three or during the finale of season two. By introduced I am implying that the residents will become aware of the pregnancy. I could see an interesting season long arc with expecting parents becoming overly cautious, withdrawn and slightly hostile near the end. I'm not certain what it will do to the morale level among the survivors, but I'd wager at least one or two would have a pessimistic view of the whole thing.

'Hooray, another mouth to feed... great.'

Discuss.

[7oddisdead]

I like the angle this would take the story in..especially when you consider that would be one more thing for Michael to have to deal with..so many different angles could come up IF pegs were to be pregnant..

[Osiris]

I like the angle this would take the story in..especially when you consider that would be one more thing for Michael to have to deal with..so many different angles could come up IF pegs were to be pregnant..


Ever the if.

[Zombiehead]

Hasn't it only been like 2 weeks since the beach house? To answer your question I see any pregnancy in this early in the story as a handicap rather than a beacon of hope. More reasons to be less reckless, make more sacrifices, and to slow down when you should be running faster.

[Waldo Butters]

If Pegs was the one who was pregnant (because its either her or Lizzie seeing as how they're the only ones knocking boots on a quasi-regular basis) it would finally give her a purpose because, while she has been improving (i.e. shooting and training for the 'copter) she's still kinda useless. The child would give her a reason to get tough and hulk out when somthing threatens her kid.

The idea of a baby in an zombie apocalypse scenario isn't one I've heard of lasting long. What happens when they're trying to hid and the baby starts wailing? Babies and zombies with good ears could be a horrible mix for the survivors....

[Zombiehead]

The idea of a baby in an zombie apocalypse scenario isn't one I've heard of lasting long. What happens when they're trying to hid and the baby starts wailing? Babies and zombies with good ears could be a horrible mix for the survivors.... Exactly! You beat me before I could add that to my post! :p

[Waldo Butters]

Exactly! You beat me before I could add that to my post! :p

It's always somthing that's bugged me. I'm not an expert on every zombie fiction in every form of media ever, but I'm pretty savvy and I have never heard of a baby making it. They're either zombie babies or the movie ends/the mom is eaten before she can give birth. I just hope I'm in a cave in Nunavut, Canada (because come on, it'll be cake to kill the whole 3 people who live there) when my babymama gives birth.

[7oddisdead]

While not a zombie film...im gonna go ahead and give the movie feast 2 as a possible (although disturbing) baby situation during a zombie outbreak...not pleasant

[Waldo Butters]

While not a zombie film...im gonna go ahead and give the movie feast 2 as a possible (although disturbing) baby situation during a zombie outbreak...not pleasant

Oh man, I was trying to block that movie out of my memory.... but yeah, I see what you mean, VERY unpleasant.

[Magrat]

I like the angle this would take the story in..especially when you consider that would be one more thing for Michael to have to deal with..so many different angles could come up IF pegs were to be pregnant..

Plus if something happens to the baby, not only would that be traumatic for the listener, but it would add an insane amount of tension between the tower residents, depending on who's 'fault' it was.

[Osiris]

Plus if something happens to the baby, not only would that be traumatic for the listener, but it would add an insane amount of tension between the tower residents, depending on who's 'fault' it was.

Whose fault was it? Do we start a pool on who gets pregnant and who ends up getting the little one killed?

[Magrat]

Whose fault was it? Do we start a pool on who gets pregnant and who ends up getting the little one killed?

Wow that's macabre! ... 10 bucks says Michael gets it killed and it's lizzy's?

Wait, better. Lizzy is preggers, has it while still with maulers, Scratch takes it and raises it to hate pegs! Done.

[7oddisdead]

Holy crap...excellent/\

[Grognaurd]

Plus if something happens to the baby, not only would that be traumatic for the listener, but it would add an insane amount of tension between the tower residents, depending on who's 'fault' it was.

Do not forget the trauma to the listeners! It would be simply gratuitous. I listen to things like We're Alive to escape reality. If I wanted to hear about the murder of children, I will turn on the evening news.

[beesting]

Even if it has only been a couple weeks since the beach house it only takes one time to get pregnant and depending on how sensitive your body is, you can tell pretty quick that something has changed. Add that to the fact that they are all somewhat undernourished means you'd probably notice these changes more quickly than in normal society. Also, wouldn't it put more pressure to get out to Ft Irwin more quickly? A baby would be safer out there. I really hope no one's pregnant.

[Laura]

I would be so bummed if Pegs or Lizzy were pregnant. More so if it were Pegs because I just can't stand her for some reason. It wouldn't work out in the series very well, and I would be extremely surprised if they actually introduce a storyline like that.

[Fisheye]

I am pretty sure the "sexually active" women have been running out of contraception pills by now lol. This isn't the first thing you grab when you run away from your house during a zombie apocalypse. Will be pretty funny to have Pegs asking during a meds/food raid " Can you grab me a boxe of contraception pills and condoms please, you know just in case".
The hard life of being a woman during an outbreak of zombie.... O_o

[Laura]

Lol, you're so right, Fisheye!

"What do you need in particular?"
"Well... me and Michael are gettin' it on, soooooooo could you get me some birth control and condoms? Thanks so much!"

[Osiris]

Hey let's not drag Scratch into this... keep it clean.

[StickUpKid]

IT would be ironic if it went all "the child is the salvation of humanity we shall make a cure from it"

[Osiris]

IT would be ironic if it went all "the child is the salvation of humanity we shall make a cure from it"


Satan willing, this will never come to pass. I would hope that Kc would have more sense than to stoop to that level. I really hope he goes the 'no fucking cure, sorry everyone' route and stays true to the source material. Zombies just happen. There is no cure. They just happen.

[zombeh-kitteh]

At first, I also believed that it could be a pregnancy for Lizzy. Pegs, I attributed her getting nauseous from "Ground Zero." Because Victor also started getting sick.

Another possibility I thought of that maybe it's not pregancy, but rather the food that's affecting them? I say this because Pegs eats the cracker but then has to get out to vomit. But once stopped, Victor also gets ill because they're near "Ground Zero."

But then, the food would be affecting more then just Lizzy and Pegs, so that's out.

I think there's something else going on with Lizzy rather than her being pregnant. First of all, she seems to be getting sick on a basis more frequent than morning sickness. I'm not a mother nor a medical expert but this is just me. However, I can't really explain how or why she's getting sick like this without being pregnant...because if it's something in the air, water, ect then everyone would be getting sick, not just an isolated two people who happen to be young females.

So I think that if there is a pregant lady out there, then it's probably Lizzy. Which makes her situation even more tenuous than it already is.

[Don Man]

I think the main 3 laddies (pegs,riley and lizzie) will have kids at one point in the show. Yes thats right i think rileys staright

[Gunslinger]

I thought I read somewhere that women who are in high stress situations where flight or fight situations occurred had a tendency not to conceive and even abort/miscarry babies due to some kind of physiological response. That could make this a difficult proposition.

However, in response to a pregnancy, I would also think that you would see a wide variety of responses to it as the people of the Tower all saw it by their own individual outlook on life, birth, and their situation. Some would be positive, as a marker of hope or at least a sign of their former states. Others would see it as a burden or threat. Then the whole gamut in between as well. There's what, 47 of them?

[ToxicTofu]

Quick thought... Lizzy.. she tends to throw up a lot... morning sickness? dun dun dun...

[Osiris]

Quick thought... Lizzy.. she tends to throw up a lot... morning sickness? dun dun dun...

Now you're thinkin' with butter!

[ilanagl]

WALKING DEAD SPOILER

If we've learned anything from the walking dead it's that getting preggers during a zombie apocalypse is never a good idea.

[Magrat]

Now you're thinkin' with butter!

When Michael and the others were moving the dead bodies the first time they were in the tower, they were throwing up a lot. Preggers?
No. But they should be!

[KeAnna Means]

I was wondering if its possible if Lizzy is pregnant, that the baby might not be Sauls. What was the name of the boyfriend that got killed right before she got into the tower?

[nikvoodoo]

I was wondering if its possible if Lizzy is pregnant, that the baby might not be Sauls. What was the name of the boyfriend that got killed right before she got into the tower?

Todd was his name. I believe it was Yarri some where 'round here that said if Todd was the father of the supposed baby that it would be far more apparent that Lizzy was pregnant simply because by the time she was kidnapped by the Mallers she would have been through her first trimester and into the second one (She arrived at the Tower on May 9, 2009 in the early AM, and the story is currently at the end of August '09).

[KeAnna Means]

Okay, Im not at all sure about the timeline. Lizzy and Saul's relationship has always seemed a little rushed to me. I still dont quite buy it.

[Gunslinger]

one person pukes and everyone screams baby. Its just the way things go for some people.

[Osiris]

one person pukes and everyone screams baby. Its just the way things go for some people.


Nobody is 'screaming' baby. Though you would be burying your head in the sand if you believed that it wouldn't happen eventually.

[Gunslinger]

Nobody is 'screaming' baby. Though you would be burying your head in the sand if you believed that it wouldn't happen eventually.

Sure, its always possible. I'm not ruling it out, just that I'm not committing to that story line and don't see a lot to support it beyond some possible boinking and some puking.

[Osiris]

Sure, its always possible. I'm not ruling it out, just that I'm not committing to that story line and don't see a lot to support it beyond some possible boinking and some puking.


More or less looking at the possibility in the context of how that might affect the residents... but carry on.

[snowcoma]

Personally, I'm hoping for a baby. I'm a sucker for pregnancy and baby stories, due to wanting to be a mother myself.

As for the survival, if they can keep Lady safe, they can manage a baby. A child crying 12 stories up in a closed room isn't really an issue. Diapers are going to be a bigger problem than zombies, in my opinion.

[Osiris]

Personally, I'm hoping for a baby. I'm a sucker for pregnancy and baby stories, due to wanting to be a mother myself.

As for the survival, if they can keep Lady safe, they can manage a baby. A child crying 12 stories up in a closed room isn't really an issue. Diapers are going to be a bigger problem than zombies, in my opinion.


Lol... trying to change diapers and fend of a zombie attack... there's a movie in there somewhere... 3 Men and A Baby with Zombies... comedy gold!

[nikvoodoo]

The diapers could be an effective weapon of mass distration for the zombies. It would be smelly enough to throw them off the human stench. Just leave a rotting pile of diapers at the front door and the zombies won't think twice. :p

[Gunslinger]

Lol... trying to change diapers and fend of a zombie attack... there's a movie in there somewhere... 3 Men and A Baby with Zombies... comedy gold!

Heck, maybe, Baby of the Dead or Argh, It's Talking.

[Osiris]

Heck, maybe, Baby of the Dead or Argh, It's Talking.


This raises another interesting question... what effect (if any) will Ground Zero have on newborns? Will they but susceptible to the infection? Will they be immune? Will there be a cure found through them?

[Gunslinger]

This raises another interesting question... what effect (if any) will Ground Zero have on newborns? Will they but susceptible to the infection? Will they be immune? Will there be a cure found through them?

I don't think anything has really been established as to the source of the infection. Even calling it an infection is an assumption, so far. Blood and air are out as modes of transmission thus far. I think only bites, possibly scratches, have changed anyone. The not crossing species thing is indicative of a virus, though, isn't it? Can't say I know much about it, really, but with all the theories out there as to the source of the zombies, who knows what may happen to a child born in that environment. Could be alien crossbreeding, or pollinated, or mutated...

Frankly, I would be scared to bring a child into that environment, especially with the source of the predicament so unknown. It could turn into its own set of horrors. *shudder*

[Osiris]

I don't think anything has really been established as to the source of the infection. Even calling it an infection is an assumption, so far. Blood and air are out as modes of transmission thus far. I think only bites, possibly scratches, have changed anyone. The not crossing species thing is indicative of a virus, though, isn't it? Can't say I know much about it, really, but with all the theories out there as to the source of the zombies, who knows what may happen to a child born in that environment. Could be alien crossbreeding, or pollinated, or mutated...

Frankly, I would be scared to bring a child into that environment, especially with the source of the predicament so unknown. It could turn into its own set of horrors. *shudder*

Using previous episodes as canon, I made the assumption that there is a Ground Zero. At this location in the city something happened and now there are Zeds walking around biting, killing and apparently kidnapping people, no real stretching there. There are areas that make people sick being near, which I could only assume would be ground zero, once more not a terrible distance to stretch. Now knowing these three points, I make the stretch to infection. Not a really long way to go, and really works best to avoid catching myself in the trap of 'could be aliens, could be systemic, could be God fuckin with us.' Given that Tommy was bitten, then shortly thereafter turned into one of the Zeds... the case for a systemic infection is strengthened. Saul's contact with Tommy, the bullet and blood also stengthens the case as the infection may very well have been neutralized by the heat from the bullet or simply a natural immunity. Viruses have crossed species in the past: Marburg, Ebola, Mad Cow, hanta, HIV, influenza, nipah... all very real, very dangerous viruses. This only raises further questions. Sigh.

If it is a virus/disease and it is not showing signs of having crossed the species barrier, does that strengthen the case for a strain that is targeted specifically toward humans? I would go out on a limb and say that it does, which leads me along the lines of it being a man-made pathogen of some sort. Who else would want to kill off huge sections of the population? Does this completely rule out animals as potential carries for the virus? I'm not positive that it does. We've seen the 'Zombie Virus' carried in animals in the past, though I'm hopeful that won't occur in this particular universe.

Obviously nothing has been established and these are only assumptions or this wouldn't be in theories... I just really hope it isn't something as lame as aliens :P

[symon_r]

Viruses have crossed species in the past: Marburg, Ebola, Mad Cow, hanta, HIV, influenza, nipah... all very real, very dangerous viruses.

Quick science note, mad cow disease is prion based. I think prions have come up before on this forum and, for me, are genuinely fascinating and terrifying.

Getting back on topic. I didnt agree with the initial views that Lizzy was pregnant, I thought it was much more likely to be a "symptom" of what she was going through at the time. Now that element of the story has persisted and the idea from this thread of contraception during a zombie apocolypse have got me thinking I could be wrong..

[GD_Elite]

@Gunslinger and Osiris:
I don't think it was proven that the bullet that hit Saul went through Tommy first, just speculation by Burt.
Also, Tommy got a cut during the first pipe bomb, and when the jumper got hit with a shotgun, blood and guts went on Tommys cut and infected him.

On topic: IF Lizzy is pregnant and having morning sickness, then it is worth noting that Scratch may want her for this reason. Seeing as the reason Scratch changes her mind and wants her alive as soon as she sees that she is sick.

[Osiris]

Quick science note, mad cow disease is prion based. I think prions have come up before on this forum and, for me, are genuinely fascinating and terrifying.

Getting back on topic. I didnt agree with the initial views that Lizzy was pregnant, I thought it was much more likely to be a "symptom" of what she was going through at the time. Now that element of the story has persisted and the idea from this thread of contraception during a zombie apocolypse have got me thinking I could be wrong..

She may or may not be. I'm not saying with absolute certainty that she is, it just struck me that she may be and as such I ran with the idea.


@Gunslinger and Osiris:
I don't think it was proven that the bullet that hit Saul went through Tommy first, just speculation by Burt.
Also, Tommy got a cut during the first pipe bomb, and when the jumper got hit with a shotgun, blood and guts went on Tommys cut and infected him.

Good catch. My bad and duly noted, sir.

[Gunslinger]

@Gunslinger and Osiris:
I don't think it was proven that the bullet that hit Saul went through Tommy first, just speculation by Burt.
Also, Tommy got a cut during the first pipe bomb, and when the jumper got hit with a shotgun, blood and guts went on Tommys cut and infected him.

On topic: IF Lizzy is pregnant and having morning sickness, then it is worth noting that Scratch may want her for this reason. Seeing as the reason Scratch changes her mind and wants her alive as soon as she sees that she is sick.

Oh, I forgot how Tommy got infected... ugh... that is something. I don' t know what prions are, is that what they were talking about when they mentioned something to do with "protein strains" or something like that? Like I said, I don't actually know anything about disease or how it works... I just thought I had heard that they don't usually cross species, which is what makes the ones that do particularly nasty. If that's not the case, its all good, just thought I'd heard that. I don't know jack or scheitt. =)

[Solanine]

If, and I say If, the cause of the events is an infection then possibly killed/ inactive particles could be circulating in the air. I'm not any sort of expert on these things so feel free to correct me at any point. So the survivors could be growing immunity to the infection. This could result in there children being immune to the infection. See "The Stand" (Steven King) for an example.

[7oddisdead]

Scratch, you effing genius....

so what evidence do we have of Lizzie being pregnant?....vomit. At every point she is drug to Lizzie seems to on que...vomit

Perhaps scratch noted this and regardless of whether or not Lizzie is pregnant or not, scratch ran with the idea. If someone in the Z/A is with child...9 times out if 10...somebody is going to be looking for her..bargaing chip deluxe

I'll almost guarantee scratch makes the claim to Saul that lizzies pregnant before Lizzie ever gets the chance to address it. Incentive for her to get what she wants(pegs)....

[awkwardalex]

'Hooray, another mouth to feed... great.'

Discuss.


Who bets that will qoute will be Kelly?

[clparson]

I think there are zombie spores that are in the air around Ground Zero and that these spores are insiminating
the women. Riley, however, has not been insiminated because maybe her baby making parts are not working and is perhaps part of the reason she likes females. There would be no "We should have a baby" talk.

[ZombChick16]

Am i the only one who thinks Lizzie is pregnant?!?! It makes sense because Scratch said I have TWO people you want when she only had Lizzie. And Lizzie was throwing up a bunch. Plus, that's why Scratch didn't kill her. It's one thing to kill a person but it's another to kill someone who is carrying a child. Anybody else agree???

[Solanine]

Am i the only one who thinks Lizzie is pregnant?!?! It makes sense because Scratch said I have TWO people you want when she only had Lizzie. And Lizzie was throwing up a bunch. Plus, that's why Scratch didn't kill her. It's one thing to kill a person but it's another to kill someone who is carrying a child. Anybody else agree???
At this point its something everyone assumes, although I'm not sure Lizzy being pregnant would stop scratch, she seems to be a psychopath in the true meaning of the word.

[mem]

Scratch eats babies and Twinkies. There is a shortage of Twinkies.

[reaper239]

mmmm, babies.

[Miss]

don't get me wrong it would be an interesting if she WAS going to have a baby, I have been trying to do the math in when she could have gotten that way, might be my math wrong but there wasn't any point where where she could have gotten in the "family way". When she first got to the tower was dealing with the loss of "Todd". By the time she warmed up to Saul to it was around the start of July and the big fight of July 4/5 then Saul got shot and almost died. When he got better enough to have the energy to do the act, Lizzie got kicked out/ Though they were never alone for extended periods of time.