What do you think is happening around the world in We're Alive?

[Onslaught]

Think about it, Tokyo, Mexico City, NY, Shanghai, Moscow... all of these are some of the biggest cities in the world. So what is happening there. It was around evening when the outbreak began in LA. These cities are always full of people wandering the streets, so how bad do you guys think it is?

[nikvoodoo]

Any major city will be completely decimated if something like this were to happen. New York especially would be a blood bath. New Yorkers by nature don't really notice what's going on around them unless it's truly eye catching. By the time they'd notice something, it might be too late. We honestly are always told to look for terrorists and suspicious packages that I know I'd probably not notice a wave of zombies coming up behind me....

....also probably because I'd be listening to We're Alive as I was walking and wouldn't hear them coming....

But back to the question: I feel like there's pockets of survivors in every major city in the world. Someone would be able to out last that initial onslaught (ha!) and probably hold up somewhere and be safe. Staten Island (as much as we all make fun of it) would be one of the safest places to start the apocalypse because it is off there on its own and would require more travel time to get to (assuming the outbreak starts in Manhattan). That or Liberty Island, but Liberty Island isn't a place you could survive for long. Nothing there to sustain you.

[ObamaCat]

Somewhere isolated and self-sufficient like Nepal might have a great deal of survivors.

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

Well here in Miami (city of nothing but warehouses) we're holed up behind hurrican shuddered walmarts and Sams clubs. Some have made it to hurricane shelters, not many, but enough. I do think people would actually be headed BACK to Cuba. ROFL!

[HomeGrown]

Sounds like they must have destroyed every major city by now, but with three groups of survivors in a relatively small area, there must be hundreds or thousands of others. However, somewhere there is a horde on a military base, with the smart ones learning how to use tanks.

[Private Parts]

Well over here in the uk we would be pretty fucked because of our gun laws police oficers not carrying guns etc but some parts of scotland would be survivable due to being remote, people have there own guns for hunting eg deer. You would be pretty safe untill the food ran out. Maybe the 'zombies' wouldnt like the weather!

[Solanine]

Shut up parts, I reckon the UK would have more time to react. possibly military re deployed to protect. if it was to get out of hand we would be in a bad position. Fast zombies are much more dangerous if you only have an axe to fight them off with. I reckon there must be quite a few Afghanistani survivors. unfortunately they're probably Taliban holding out in cave systems. Places like Shanghai with high population density would be very hard hit. I reckon you could create a community on the roofs of blocks flats and other buildings (gods gardeners style) if you connected them all and blocked of the entrances from the ground.

[ramsbilly]

"decimated" means to reduce by 10 percent... i think the losses would be more like 99%

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

Places far away from any major airport or Highway would hold out for a very long time. Remote places like parts of Montana, the Dakotas, the UP in Michigan, the smaller Hawaiian islands.
- You'd have hundreds of cruise ships out during the initial outbreak.
- The Navy's of the word would be pretty well off because of the numbers of ships that will be underway
- Mongolia
- Many parts of Sub saharan Africa
- Isolated parts of Australia
- the greater NW part of WA state..
- North Korea
- People stuck on the runways of many airports and in the planes in holding patterns waiting to land
of course this is all my speculation

[Solanine]

It interesting, many remote villages are dependant on supplies from other places so when the food already there runs out the survivors would have to travel long distances to get basic supplies. they also would have less experience fighting the infected than city dwellers and would suffer heavy losses because of this.

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

You have to remember that people in remote areas are more self sustainable. They're hunters, farmers and builders. Urbanites are more dependent on supplies because we don't need to have those skills. If we can't get it from Amazon.com, grocery stores or Target, we're pretty screwed.

As far as them having "less" experience.. flip that. They'll be more experienced at surviving period. They'll be more likely to own several fire arms or other weapons for hunting.

[Eviebae]

As far as them having "less" experience.. flip that. They'll be more experienced at surviving period. They'll be more likely to own several fire arms or other weapons for hunting.

What about gang members, or people from other countries where they've survived armed conflict?

We're just talking these zombies, right? You had waves of people washing over the city like an infected tsunami with no warning sirens. The news was less than helpful--saying it was just riots etc. That's what made it so difficult. You would basically just have what you were seeing and hearing to react to with no guidance as to the best response. Maybe the people in remote areas would respond correctly, maybe not.

Something that just occurred to me, you have less people in the country but you have more big meat animals like cows to munch on.

[Solanine]

Yeah, thats what I was saying about the people in conflicts in Afganistan. Bases of UN forces alive still? Taliban alive in their cave complexes :(.

[Solanine]

I live in a remote area of Scotland. There are a few people with survival training and who are mostly self sufficient but most people up here travel the 2-3 hours to get their food from Tesco. It's true that their are far more remote places than a small village in the highlands but still, people are far to used to modern life.

[Solanine]

So far in the series we have learned of at east four different groups of survivors (Michaels tower, Samantha's tower, the mallers and the colony) but who else is out there where are the military and where did the helicopters escort civilians to before the colony was formed? Please discuss.

[Eviebae]

We're probably going to make the rounds seeing what's going on as the series progresses running into any number of dystopias.

The thing that makes this podcast superior is the scenarios play out in different ways than the stereotypical neat wrap up hero's win type thing. I liked the dialog at the beginning too--very naturalistic, though it's getting less so.

You have the zombies, the survivors and the cause all making things interesting.

[Solanine]

Yeah, the latest arc with the colony has been too much talking not enough Burt. I'm no sure in what form we will come across the place that people were evacuated to but it will be cool. Possibly they come across the place all burned down and with bodies everywhere. Or they are greeted with fresh eggs and bacon. Either way it seems like a cool end point for the whole series.

[Eviebae]

I hope we learn a little more about what caused it.

[Solanine]

Would be good, I'm sure Kc will explain it some how. Really I'm more interested in what happens after, but it would be cool backgroung information to have.

[David Foley]

I believe, as you guys have already said, that the more urbanized and/or overpopulated areas of the world would have been almost immediately affected if (or when) the virus got their from its supposed epicenter of San Francisco, leaving the more remote outposts of the world untouched. However, in places of the world in which it is both urban and highly populated, do you think that they would be more inclined to spread out or resort to simply attacking the other zombies? We already know that they will eat each other, but do you think that they would be more likely to resort to cannibalism as their primary source of food, or would they spread out in search of easier prey?

[Solanine]

Thats an interesting point, possibly both? I'm sure in densely populated areas they would become very aggressive. I wonder though, can they BREED? If so the tower might as well commit mass suicide.

[Eviebae]

I wonder though, can they BREED?

GAAAAAAAHHHHRRRRGGGHHHHH! I want to turn off my imagination now, please?...

[David Foley]

I wonder though, can they BREED?
That's actually an interesting question. I would assume that they can. I mean, they are essentially human beings anatomically, and they do have animalistic instincts, so that's extraordinarily probable.

[Hollomandious]

That's actually an interesting question. I would assume that they can. I mean, they are essentially human beings anatomically, and they do have animalistic instincts, so that's extraordinarily probable.

Stop! Yer makin' my brain hurt!

We've seen how they are with the whole hunger thing, if they got sexual urges. Eep!

We're Alive:SVU.

Ha!

[MrScott101]

What I find interesting is there are no young children or very hardly mentioned, are those the little ones? As for the world, I think it's the same scenario all over with pockets of survivors here and there. My guess is that there are zombies that have adapted to the different environments all over. For all we know there could be whole different evolutionary process and it speeds up very quickly considering how fast the virus itself takes hold of a person.

[Eviebae]

We're Alive:SVU.

Ha!

Come to think of it, are they identifiable as male or female? Some of them have to be naked by now--especially the behemoths. Angel's girlfriend was a zombie so both sexes can be turned. But, I remember someone (Riley?) saying that the sweat made them salivate like her dog did when he was around a girl dog in heat. That seems like a re-purposing of the sex drive towards hunting/killing. If it's an engineered situation I suppose it will depend on the intention behind it.





What I find interesting is there are no young children or very hardly mentioned, are those the little ones? As for the world, I think it's the same scenario all over with pockets of survivors here and there. My guess is that there are zombies that have adapted to the different environments all over. For all we know there could be whole different evolutionary process and it speeds up very quickly considering how fast the virus itself takes hold of a person.

I did notice the lack of kids mentioned but I figured it was because it would be too graphic otherwise. I think story-wise it will be really interesting to see the different scenarios they find.

[Roadkill1986]

I think they were all it about the same time as L.A. They were attacks by Terrorist, Foreign Country, or Religious Freaks. Wether they got wiped out (accidentally or otherwise) is still up in the air.
Proof:

DVR
1. It mentions that similar "riots" were happening in majors cities around the world.
2. Everything recorded even an hour latter was nothing but static. (unless everyone who lived in the tower before that had a DVR only had cable; I doubt people with DVR and satellite would have their reception knocked out an hour after news coverage.)

Kalani
1. "Did you think they (zombies) swam to Hawaii?"
2. He mentions that the ones there seemed a bit meaner. With Hawaii being small islands the Adv. Flesh Biters would seem more common.
3. The other tower had taken "strange devices" from ground zero.
4. Scavengers got sick when they got close to ground zero.

[StickUpKid]

Why have we not heard about anything from other states? Like im sure someone would have tryed to comeback to L.A to find loved ones. Where is the military? I'm sure they were not all overrun.

[shadow]

I would think most civies would be locked in a fight of survival. As far as the military goes, they have the infrastructure and comm equipment to keep updated, they are probably on a base by base lockdown, until they can agree on and secure a rendezous point.

[COsurvivor]

Cheyenne Mountain is probably closed up tight and just sitting back and watching it all on Satellite.

[DeRose05]

I would have to think that Fort Knox and Fort Benning, would be "safe" Fort Knox not only has the majority of the tanks not overseas, but it also has a massive "safe/vault" guarded by a mint police force, apaches, artillery, and over 30k soldiers. Oh and the doors are over 20+ inches thick. As for Benning, its a self supporting base for over 120k soldiers with tanks, some of the 75th ranger regiment, 3rd Heavy combat brigade, 3rd infantry, and most important, the 14th combat support hospital. I think Benning would be a place people would rally to on the east coast. Im not sure if i missed this part, but i would be VERY curious to know how Camp Pendleton is holding out in the story.

[DeRose05]

I would have to think that areas with few people and areas with a large amount of guns/weapons would be able to hold out a little better. I would bet that there is a large amount of survivors in the southern American states. Not only do they have a large amount of fire arms, but they have natural defenses. The only thing that comes to mind, for a reason the "south" would fall is that those with guns go and fight without some sort of organization.

As for other parts of the world, i think it would really depend if the virus/plague/magic/etc hit Europe, Asia, and Africa. I would have to think that places like India, china, and japan would be hit very hard. On the other side, i could see people holding out in Russia. : ) i wonder what would happen to the zombies in the extreme cold.

[bequita]

These zombies adapt with skills they had in life, so I think cold zombies would exist.

[DeRose05]

These zombies adapt with skills they had in life, so I think cold zombies would exist.

I would have to agree about the skills part, but skill has nothing to do with -30 weather. Flesh is flesh after all and the zombies would freeze. Who knows though? lol right KC :cool:

[bequita]

I would have to agree about the skills part, but skill has nothing to do with -30 weather. Flesh is flesh after all and the zombies would freeze. Who knows though? lol right KC :cool:

That is assuming they are still functioning as warm blooded animals. Their leathery skin and prefence to nighttime may indicate evolution of sorts. Maybe they evolve into creatures with less body regulating required

[Ra1th]

I would have to agree about the skills part, but skill has nothing to do with -30 weather. Flesh is flesh after all and the zombies would freeze. Who knows though? lol right KC :cool:

flesh is flesh, and the human body isnt capable of running at 50 miles per hour like the runners, or jumping across buildings in a single leap or swim for days at a time like the swimmers, so there probably could be those that can withstand severe cold and severe heat, hell they know how to create fire, from the descriptions given of the arena

[shadow]

as far as the east coast goes, i wonder how Paris island, SC and Fort Bragg, NC would be holding up? You would think that with so many bases and all out forts on the east coast, and in the south, that things might be slightly better.

[shananala8]

This is all based on the assumption that whatever caused the outbreaks wouldn't hit any major military bases. As massive and well armed as some of the bases are, that doesn't mean they'd...

[Luna Guardian]

Cheyenne Mountain is probably closed up tight and just sitting back and watching it all on Satellite.
Lol, I just imagined Obama sitting in a recliner and shouting to his Chief of Staff "Bring the Popcorn, the new Survivors is on!"

EDIT: As for the military bases, I don't know how the US military bases are set up, but going by Finnish standards, if the population of Helsinki (a very small city by US standards, but still the biggest we've got) would turn into zombies, even with the entire reserve force it's been "assigned", the Santahamina garrison would be overrun very quickly, and it's an island. I don't know how many people turned into zombies, but let's say a million fleshbiters were to rush for Fort Benning, that's mean that every soldier would have to kill roughly 8 zombies before they'd get to biting distance. Also keep in mind, that these soldiers are trained to fight other soldiers, not homicidal berserkers with superhuman abilities and little care for personal safety.

[StickUpKid]

May be they will encounter soldiers at the fort they are trying to go to. Oh and Luna Guardian but they things soilders are trained to kill are far away. These zombies/mutants what have you are just running at you there to need to take cover and they are right there to kill but i still see your point that they are extremely reckless. Oh and another quick question did anyone notice that scratch and angel knew eachother?

[DeRose05]

I think that at Knox and Benning, the force would be overkill. These are two bases that are on high alert already, due to possible terror attacks, etc. Sure the Z's might get a few of the guys, but those places are made to be locked down and defended.

[Luna Guardian]

As someone who has been in the military (Finnish military, but military none the less) I can tell you that not only would a million+ rushing people cause an "Oh shit, oh shit, OH SHIT!" reaction in most people, it's actually difficult to kill something that's far away. A human will not die if you shoot one in the stomach or in a limb or even in the chest if you miss the heart. These zombies are more resilient than humans, so it's a safe bet that they would take a lot more damage to take down. And before you bring headshots into the discussion, do you know how hard it is to score a lethal headshot? For simplicity's sake, let's say the human brain ends around your nose. That still leaves 1/3 of your head as unnecessary. Can you hit a fast moving target running towards you, probably zig-zagging as we've seen, that's that small? Very few people can. I'm an excellent marksman and I've recevied commendations for my skill and I sure as hell wouldn't want to risk my life on a shot like that.

As you said, the soldiers are trained to kill things that are far away. However, the effective range of an assault rifle is somewhere around 150m (we use 7.62 ammo in our assault rifles, I'm not sure what the 5.56 range is) and much less if you want an accurate shot on a moving target. We've seen how fast the zombies are, but even a human, running balls-out, can cover that much ground very quickly. The reason soldiers get to shoot at their enemies is because both sides take cover and don't move closer to engage in hand to hand. Yes, full auto and machine guns will mow down the zombies, but they also waste a lot of ammo. The troops on the base aren't likely to be in full combat readiness all the time, some are having chow and some are training somewhere, therefore they aren't likely to carry their entire wartime loadout with them. But for the sake of argument, let's say they would. Even so, with full auto, an assault rifle and a machine gun empty in a matter of seconds. It takes reasonably long for a human body to fall down dead, especially since the 5.56 lacks the strength to punch someone backwards. The dying or falling zombies would shield their comrades even without any effort by the shielder or the shieldee.

And what if the attack came during the night? I don't care how tough your rangers are (and I know they eat nails and shit steel chain), they have to sleep in order to remain functional. Human beings are just built that way. The entire base would be overrun and chaotic very quickly with every human bitten becoming another zombie. That's one of the greatest strengths of the undead, they make themselves stronger by making us weaker.

Just my two cents. I'm not trying to talk smack about the US army or any other, but facts are facts and they have to be faced

[shananala8]

And to add to that, they're not going to instantly know that they're under attack by a zombie horde. Just like in the news reports, they'll assume that it's a riot or something else that doesn't require their full power. By the time there are zombies within the perimeter, it's likely to be too late.

[DeRose05]

well technically, humans CAN do what you have listed (maybe not the swimming for days/months underwater lol).
Usain bolt's fastest is around 27 mph/44kmh. Sports science says that with current info, human might hit the physical max of around 35-40mph in the future. There are also suggestion that speed is simply limited by how hard the runner can strike a running surface(extra zombie strength).
That in turn could increase how far/high a person can jump. So i guess i could say, from at least a physical standpoint, that it is possible for the runners and jumpers (maybe one in the same) to do what you listed. Cold and heat are a different thing though.
At around 1400 F(sustained), a human body will ignite. A campfire can do that. This would be considered hard, compared to flesh freezing. The human body is mostly water. The problem with that, is anything around freezing point, will turn solid. Im sure most of you have put meat in a freezer and at some point found it at a later date. Thats what would happen to flesh. I could be a bit more graphic, but freezing would/should be a big problem for the zombies...unless a bunch of the smart ones decide to take up making tacky Christmas sweaters for them to wear in the cold.
GRANTED this is not real life (i hope) lol

All of that being said, i really think that places like Canada, Alaska, Russia, Scandinavia, other rather cold places; would at least have some sort of chance to get organized with proper offensive and defensive plans while the Z's are frozen. (perhaps defrost when its warmer.)

ALSO, who isnt down for a bunch of Canadians with maple syrup and skis, blowing holes into the Z's. Im sure they would be very polite about it and give the Z's a proper warning. (the movie Canadian Bacon anyone? hehe)

[DeRose05]

the last two posters make valid points, but look at an aerial/geography of both fort knox and Benning. Here are a few facts to support my case. I'll start with Fort knox

This is a fort made to store and protect most of Americas gold. It has 20+inch reinforced blast doors and walls with a closed air/water lines. On top of that, there are the troops i stated before with armored combat military vehicles, tanks, and many artillery pieces. If you google search the image of this area, you can also see that the place already has a clear line of sight to a tree line and can be defended with relative safety, around the entire "vault"(small bunkers line the walls). I should have also stated earlier that the biggest weapon these places would have is the artillery and helicopters. I agree 100 percent when you say that shooting someone would not cut it. One last thing, it is heavy suggested that the open field around the base is heavily mined, has automated machine guns triggered by interrupting laser beams are emplaced to guard the building and its approaches, as well as ground sweeping radar, and body capacitance wires.

As for Fort Benning, The closest city is Columbus, Georgia and that city is basically nothing but the families of those at Fort Benning. From there, it is miles from the closest big cities. The zombies would have to know where the base is, (sure that could happen) but unless this all started there, it would take some time for the Zs to get in the area. By that time, i think a place with around 200k people, mostly military, could setup at least some sort of defense. Like ft. knox, the place has tons of mech vehicles, artillery, etc. This place is also self sustaining and has several natural features that could help defend the area.

So to sort of sum that all up, ft. knox is set to defend against anything that should not be there(no matter who it is), with tanks, artillery, aircraft, helicopters. Ft. Benning is far away from major cities, has over 130k active duty military there, with MORE firepower then ft. knox.

I also think everyone should go and listen to the parts about the prison and the colony. The Prison is close to a densely populated area and the colony is based around a park. These are both places in the Metro area of Greater LA, with a population of close to 18 million people. Louisville, KY (closest to Fort Knox) has 1.3 million people and Columbus, Georgia (the city made because of Ft. Benning) has a bit under 200k people. I think these are numbers that can be defended against and maybe even repulsed.

Please comment with any holes im sure i included in this small wall of text :p lol

[kafu288]

Speed is based on stride length and push down/off from the surface. If you can push down harder you will move faster. If your strides are longer you will move faster.

Oh wow... that's a hilariously scary visual. 5 zombies doing the stretch-armed shuffle down the road in christmas jumpers chasing me.

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

As someone who has been in the military (Finnish military, but military none the less) I can tell you that not only would a million+ rushing people cause an "Oh shit, oh shit, OH SHIT!" reaction in most people, it's actually difficult to kill something that's far away. A human will not die if you shoot one in the stomach or in a limb or even in the chest if you miss the heart. These zombies are more resilient than humans, so it's a safe bet that they would take a lot more damage to take down. And before you bring headshots into the discussion, do you know how hard it is to score a lethal headshot? For simplicity's sake, let's say the human brain ends around your nose. That still leaves 1/3 of your head as unnecessary. Can you hit a fast moving target running towards you, probably zig-zagging as we've seen, that's that small? Very few people can. I'm an excellent marksman and I've recevied commendations for my skill and I sure as hell wouldn't want to risk my life on a shot like that.

As you said, the soldiers are trained to kill things that are far away. However, the effective range of an assault rifle is somewhere around 150m (we use 7.62 ammo in our assault rifles, I'm not sure what the 5.56 range is) and much less if you want an accurate shot on a moving target. We've seen how fast the zombies are, but even a human, running balls-out, can cover that much ground very quickly. The reason soldiers get to shoot at their enemies is because both sides take cover and don't move closer to engage in hand to hand. Yes, full auto and machine guns will mow down the zombies, but they also waste a lot of ammo. The troops on the base aren't likely to be in full combat readiness all the time, some are having chow and some are training somewhere, therefore they aren't likely to carry their entire wartime loadout with them. But for the sake of argument, let's say they would. Even so, with full auto, an assault rifle and a machine gun empty in a matter of seconds. It takes reasonably long for a human body to fall down dead, especially since the 5.56 lacks the strength to punch someone backwards. The dying or falling zombies would shield their comrades even without any effort by the shielder or the shieldee.

And what if the attack came during the night? I don't care how tough your rangers are (and I know they eat nails and shit steel chain), they have to sleep in order to remain functional. Human beings are just built that way. The entire base would be overrun and chaotic very quickly with every human bitten becoming another zombie. That's one of the greatest strengths of the undead, they make themselves stronger by making us weaker.

Just my two cents. I'm not trying to talk smack about the US army or any other, but facts are facts and they have to be faced

Wow.. Ok, Hey Luna.. the Max effective range on an M16 (5.56 ball point NATO round)is 550 meters for a point target. 800 for an area target. Max range is 3600 meters.


You guys are focused on just ARMY installations and your forget there are other branches of services. USAF, USM, USCG, USN and all the various National Guard and Reserve installations.
Every installation has family that live on them... they have shooping centers (Commissary/BX) movie theatres, bowling allys..blah, blah,..
The only people armed on any installation are the MPs (Army/Marines) and SFS (USAF security forces). They work on shifts. I can only speak on the USAF side because I spent 4 years in the SFS guarding Nukes and standing under the wings of classified planes. So, at anytime in a shift you may have 17 armed people. It depends on the size of the installation.
You'll have armed guards (Civ now) at each gate and they only carry 9mil hand guns with max 36 rounds and 2 guards per post.

Those troops who aren't on duty are at home with family or on leave.. whatever. The first sign of trouble, they do a telephone recall (just like KC wrote in the first episode). You have a recall roster and it tells you who you're supposed to call after you get your call. It goes down the line untel 100 % accountability is reached for flight/battalion or unit.

You'd never reach 100% if the base is under this kind of attack. Troops families would be effected or the troops themselves.
Again, these are only those assigned to carry weapons during peace time. Cops and guards only. You arm up, get briefed on the situation and do whatever the "On Scene" Commander needs until the Commander Center stands up and you go into "Mass Casualty mode" That means that the entire MP/SFS unit would be recalled to arm up.

Special Forces troops would have the same issues. They have to get to base first and if they are on base.. they aren't armed.
Pilots, Tank drivers, etc... all the same issues.

Think about the recent shootings on the army installations... We go day to day just like you guys do, but we're just in uniform. We drop our kids off at daycare and go to work.

- Everyone else would have to fend for themselves until they got to a secured location. Spouses, Kids, Civilians....

How many troops would actually report if they had family turning? How many would make it to base if they lived OFF the installation?
There are no private firearms allowed in base housing. You have to keep your weapons in the base armory.
My installation doesn't even have long weapons. We have civilian guards and they aren't in the building proper because of clearance levels. So, if someone turned in the building.. all hell would break loose and you'd have chaos in the hallways. The only survivors would be people who didn't open the doors from the inside. (They can't be opened from the outside by just turning a knob)

I digress....
The military wouldn't enter any civilian areas until each base/post was secured first and only when/if Congress lifted Posse Comitatus Act.

The National Guard and Coast Guard are the only forces that have the ability to act on civilian soil. Again, those troops have to be recalled from HOME in order to get armed up.

[Luna Guardian]

Wow.. Ok, Hey Luna.. the Max effective range on an M16 (5.56 ball point NATO round)is 550 meters for a point target. 800 for an area target. Max range is 3600 meters.

I may have been a bit unclear. Certainly, the maximum range for an assault rifle is much longer than the 150m I stated. However, your chances of hitting something past that are minimal without added optics. The accuracy of the shot is certainly different for the 7.62 and the 5.56 as well, because the 5.56 is so much lighter (the 7.62 is more effective in woodlands combat however due to its mass, but let's not get into that here and derail the entire topic).

Also, let us assume that Knox got the alarm early enough and managed to get all suited and booted, locked and loaded (maybe the fort commander acted on his own, maybe he got authorization, just roll with it for a while). How long could Knox hold out? I'm willing to bet that within two weeks without supply runs they'd be starving, even with rationing. What about water? Medicine? The soldiers may be able to fight off the zombies that come there if they come in small enough groups, but remember that our zombies here on We're Alive bite into cans and eat everything, including dogfood. Supplies are running out, fast, and the defenders of Fort Knox would either have to leave the fort or die of starvation, thirst or sickness.

Unless the military installation is truly and completely self sufficient with enough power (solar, wind, etc) food (crops, livestock) and water (groundwells etc.), there's no way they could survive. As Crowbar said, if the zombies'd be running amok here, I would get The Call to report to my unit for certain. I'd say "Fuck you, sir", hang up and continue on with my Z-Day Plan. Fuck if I'm going to get myself killed in a Little Big Horn of our time for some people who in all likelyhood have no idea what's going on. I'd protect my family and friends, that's where I'm most needed (and consequentially, whom I most care about)

[Luna Guardian]

well technically, humans CAN do what you have listed (maybe not the swimming for days/months underwater lol).
Usain bolt's fastest is around 27 mph/44kmh. Sports science says that with current info, human might hit the physical max of around 35-40mph in the future. There are also suggestion that speed is simply limited by how hard the runner can strike a running surface(extra zombie strength).
That in turn could increase how far/high a person can jump. So i guess i could say, from at least a physical standpoint, that it is possible for the runners and jumpers (maybe one in the same) to do what you listed. Cold and heat are a different thing though.
Another thing the zombies have over us is that in most cases of physical exertion, your mind or spirit gives out way before your body does. I'm going to assume zombies don't have this issue, therefore they can push themselves to the absolute limit of their inhuman limits.

[DeRose05]

hmm well i dont know how long ft. knox could survive, long term, but they do have private closed, air,power,and water lines. I think that it is also possible that they would be able to use the many...

[DeRose05]

i totally agree. I think thats why I think it would be possible. :)

[Drew227598]

as far as the east coast goes, i wonder how Paris island, SC and Fort Bragg, NC would be holding up? You would think that with so many bases and all out forts on the east coast, and in the south, that things might be slightly better.

What about Virginia Beach with 5 SEAL teams and people like me with 12,760 Rounds of ammo (That's not a made up number; I just pulled up my inventory sheet to double check the number). Along with that there are 13 military installations in the Hampton Roads area.

[Grognaurd]

We have several nuke subs and carrier fleets out to sea

It would take a super smart one with good logistics to get to and into Area51

There are thousands of small towns. Even in these people will have hunting camps even more remote. People from cities do not comprehend how sparse the nation really is. And I do not get cities 8). When I looked at the map the colony is basically what I would call south LA. Listening to the pod casts I felt it was lie down in San Diego. The whole story has taken place in what a few hundred square miles? Me, I am more than 300 miles north of NYC. I do not know how many 15 floor towers there are in LA. But I imagine that place lit up like Xmas tree could be seen for miles and miles on a moonless night

[Solanine]

How effective would bases designed to keep humans out be against zombies, especially if they had a Behemoth and a jumper or two? If the military is out there its probably still hiding away, not risking lives trying to find survivors that might not exist. And who's to say that the chain of command would stay in tact? It hasn't in Angels unit.

[cupcakezombie]

If they hit New Zealand, it is likely only in the North Island, so I reckon I would be ok. On the flip side though, we have few guns, and other weapons around would be very basic. Our military is pretty basic and mainly goes on peace keeping duty, so they probably wouldn't be much help.
We are a pretty DIY nation, so building up protections as a group of survivors would be ok, and it doesn't take long to get out of the city and into the bush.
Probably a few other countries or areas around that are similar.

[Solanine]

I wonder, Afghanistan? I might have said this before, I'm not sure but seriously, the Taliban are armed, already have cave systems that they are familiar with defending and are experienced surviving in their surroundings. Might this apply for UN/British/American troops out there?

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

How effective would bases designed to keep humans out be against zombies, especially if they had a Behemoth and a jumper or two? If the military is out there its probably still hiding away, not risking lives trying to find survivors that might not exist. And who's to say that the chain of command would stay in tact? It hasn't in Angels unit.

Mike and crew weren't "stationed" at a real base/post. It's only a building basically. If it was an active reserve or active duty installation, there would be troops there 24/7 and have base security. They had a place to "Muster" and that's about it.

[Solanine]

I was referring to chain of command when I talked about Angels unit. I wasn't under the impression that the base with the hummers was supposed to be their Diamondium fortress.

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

I wonder, Afghanistan? I might have said this before, I'm not sure but seriously, the Taliban are armed, already have cave systems that they are familiar with defending and are experienced surviving in their surroundings. Might this apply for UN/British/American troops out there?

You have a point. At any given time you'd have thousands of Navy troops at sea, you'd have planes in the air on missions. Places like North Africa, Kenya, The "Stan or areas of China would practically be untouched. Hell, there are part of Montana that woudn't even know WTF was going on. LOL.

[Solanine]

:L, Can you imagine the look on an Inuits face when some blackened, almost dead zombie crawls at him, very slowly, across the ice. followed by like twenty others. Although I'm not sure whether zombies can get frostbite?

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

Speaking of Montana.. in the AF we have Missle bases in most of the Northern Tier bases. Crews go out for 3 days at a time and stay in fenced in and very isolated silos/areas. You have the Security Forces guarding the spot and the missle crews below ground. Nothing would get to those troops while they were out. Some places are so remote you get dropped of by helo.
You'd have pockets consisting of 12 or more heavily armed and well trained security members here and there for every NT base.
Lets throw in people like WV coal miners and Oil Rig crews into the soup as groups who'd likely survive any initial outbreak.

[GodofInsanity]

As I read through this thread there are alot of very valid points on the possibility on how different pockets of survivers could have remained. Remoteness of there location, giving them time to prepare for the impending onslaught. Amount of defence as well as large amounts of soldiers, weapons and ammunition. I do think that any military base given the time to secure a part of there base so as to not be spread too thin could hold out very well. We can use the Colony as an example. Under attack they made there defensive line and have hundreds of people according to Marcus. The biggest problem I see would be the initail reaction on the soldiers as the deadheads attacked. They would probably lose alot of men due to the insanity and disbelief by being attacked by something already dead. Then you will have to deal with the deserters who will slip through the line in search of loved ones. Once a base has shored of the lines and have survived that initail onslaught, now comes to the problems of basic survival. Usin a base like Ft. Benning, where it was stated the was 200k soldiers. Lets say that 50k survived and are now holding the lines. Not counting if any non combatants made it to the base for there protection. Now how do you feed all those people. Sure there is going to be an ample supply of food and MRE's on base. But not 3 to 4 months supplies. Maybe it can be strechted by rationing but soon the base would have to begin to forage the surrounding countryside as well as any towns or cities nearby. I amsure there is some farming and livestock to be had but I think soon that large number of troops that held the line will become very hungry.
And to touch base on missle silos. I rmember reading somewhere once upon a time that the 2 men at the silo controls were supplied for 6 months rations and water to wait out any radiation of enemy missle attacks near there location. If they let the security detail join them, that would be quartered in time but still a month to hold out in a cramped missle silo is better than becoming zombie feed.

[Don Man]

I think the situation is the same well not as intense as L.A. but I think there is one safezone somewhere

[Cabbage Patch]

Fort Irwin really is a prime example of a military base that has a good chance of surviving the initial zombie attack. This is partly because it is very isolated, and partly because very few people know about it, so there is a chance that it would get enough warning to mobilize before the zombies could arrive. When I was stationed there it was a 45 minute drive from my quarters on the base to the closest residential neighborhood of the nearest city, Barstow. Even if someone in Barstow got infected and tried to drive to the base, the odds are that they would have turned long before they could complete the drive. And Barstow itself is pretty darned isolated. The base itself is surrounded by enormous tracts of undeveloped desert in just about every direction, so the only practical overland approach is via the Interstate to Barstow, then down the one long road from there to the main gate.

Fort Irwin itself has tremendous resources available to it for zombie defense. First, it's a training base with a comparatively small resident population, but an enormous amount of hardware and ordinance. Army units travel to Fort Irwin to conduct high intensity combat training, usually as a final act before they deploy overseas. They draw their vehicles and heavy equipment from large stockpiles maintained on the base for the use of rotational units, everything ranging from Humvees to tanks. There are large stockpiles of ammunition, military rations and fuel there to support the training efforts.

The base is self-sufficient in the key areas of water (from wells) and electrical power (from the largest solar electric power generating plant in the United States).

Fort Irwin is also a "fully instrumented range complex", which is a fancy way of saying that there are videocameras capable of watching almost everything that happens there. Every action by the training units is recorded, some by stationary cameras, some by roving camera crews, and some by a set of very large cameras located in observatory domes on the mountain tops. All the images from all the cameras are fed into a central command center, where they are used to help analyze and critique the performance of training units. These systems could easily be adapted into an early warning system to watch the base's perimeter.

The biggest challenges would probably be resupplying food and vehicle fuel.

[lectio]

Is the land suitable for growing vegetables and grains?

[Cabbage Patch]

Not in the least. The area is all desert, with a pretty high alkali content. You could probably set up gardens for very heat-tolerent crops, or maybe climate-controlled greenhouses in the Isreali style, but I can't imagine being able to grow enough food at Fort Irwin to feed a large number of people.

[cycogod]

how many people die first wave? 30-50% - there are 6.9 Billion people on earth. within a month maybe 75 -90% re-animated . there are 1-2 billion people in china another 1 billion in india. not very much is gonna survive for any length of time in those odds. World War Z scenario or Day by Day - not much hope against billions .

[Solanine]

I don't think Fort Irwin is a last stop for Michael and co. by any means. In the long run just doesn't seem suitable. But it would be easier than the tower if only a few of "them" have got there. Outlasting them would be my plan in Michael's shoes. Being able to produce food enough to feed them all won't happen over night but as they adjust and learn they will most likely be able to achieve that, if not they will have to resort to fishing, in an arid desert. Or starvation if you like to call it that.

[Grognaurd]

The almost insurmountable problem with U.S. agriculture is the specialization. We grow stuff at such an industrial scale with so much technology that it is not really helpful to a group of thirty. Their best bet is to identify a hippy commune. There are prpobably a couple in southern California. If they want to be agrarian, it will take years to get off the ground. It is a hell of a lot of work. It will require livingb off the land. But the problem there is the big industrial farms are really crappy ecosystems because they are so heavily dominated By one "something". No diversity.

[Solanine]

There must be smaller independent farms with a range of products though? I suppose this is the problem with western countries, we use technology as a chair or ladder to elevate us to greater and greater heights. When the ladder is kicked away we face a hard fall that we might not survive.

[jman150]

actually the infection doesnt start in l.a because there are if you listen report of it happening at the same time in other cities like houston

[aaronarturus]

As a long time resident of Tokyo, I see things going something like this.

Just like everywhere else in the world, a mass exodus from central Tokyo. Only the roads would be much worse off than almost anywhere in the U.S. or Europe. I've attempted to drive out of Tokyo on holidays or long weekends, and traffic can be be at a practical standstill for 30 or more miles in nearly every direction out of the city. I guess we can assume the outbreak happened pretty fast, so it might be safe to assume that the metro area of Tokyo might be better off than the outlying areas and the prefectures nearby. Not that it would be safe by any means, but I think of it as a pebble dropped in a pond; fewer numbers in the center of the city, with waves of zombies spreading out. Of course they would make their way back into the city eventually, but at the beginning you might have enough time to fortify a place to live. There are massive stores of emergency supplies for earthquakes all over the city and underground, so provided you could get to them, you would have enough food to last for decades assuming a large portion of the population has turned. This goes for all major cities like Osaka, Hokkaido and the like.

Going by the reactions of people here after the earthquake last year, I think survivors would band together quickly and form communities, sharing goods and housing, protection, etc. Seeing as there are virtually no guns outside of police revolvers, and a very small amount of assault rifles in the Self Defense Forces (when compared to the U.S.), it would be nearly all melee weapons. Those who live far up in the mountains would be affected much less, and those who live on the thousands of small islands around Japan would be affected very little. There are farms and livestock on most, and populations are small enough to be sustainable. On the small islands, most people know each other and would probably have little problem banding together to clean out the few undead and set up patrols and watches.

Anyway, that's what I think would happen here in Japan.

[Jason Weiser]

Whatever it was, I doubt it was natural. It spread WAY too fast for it to be natural. Now as for what's happening elsewhere? I think much the same as in LA. Most folks fleeing the cities as fast as their conveyances can carry them, some spreading the infection far and wide. But as of now? I'd not want to be too close to a city, any city. It's just teeming with the buggers and they don't need much provocation to go chase you. So I think staying away is going to be on everyone's minds.

[Red Shirt]

Whatever it was, I doubt it was natural. It spread WAY too fast for it to be natural.

I'm OK with the speed it spread, my concern is the near simultaneous global hot zone breakouts.

[redstar]

Best place to be would be the Falkland Island, large military base, fishing industry and isolated.

[Burnsville Kit]

Interesting theories about other survivors. I've often wondered about all of the Naval vessels/sailors at sea, especially aboard subs. I'm sure that Michael will be learning about other survivors/bases besides the ones in Colorado.
Another thing I've been curious about since I started listening is the situation at the nuclear power plants in California & around the world. When the situation was becoming clear on the riots/infections, did these go into lock-down mode? Did they try to shut them down? It would be terrible to have to face a meltdown situation in addition to the zombies.

[IrishZombieKiller]

I have enjoyed reading this thread more than the others I have read in awhile. However as much as we can debate the range / accuracy of weapons and the people stations and what this does and does not do, wht we have missed is the human element. This has been touched upon several times, but not expounded upon. Mass hysteria can effect even disciplined soldiers, and when your enemy does not die by conventional means and gets back up, then you have that moment which defines you. In most cases fight or flight becomes RUN! When we have family that could be dying, or affected when we have the element of compassion which has also been brought up by the base commander in reference to the other military units, then we end up dead.

The thought which has gone into this story line is impressive.

I believe we will see the population centers fall, with small bands similar to those we have here in our favorite audio drama. The rural areas we will see resistance and some chance of hope. The more remote the better.

BTW there was an amazing amount of details provided on military facilities in this thread - should some of that be expunged?

[Red Shirt]

BTW there was an amazing amount of details provided on military facilities in this thread - should some of that be expunged?

Nahh. Any correct info is either open source, that is unclassified or declassified. Or it is wildly inaccurate, incomplete or contains redundant information or is vague enough to not be an issue.

[VEE]

Hmmm, thinking about it, the UK might very well be OK. We are quite a small island really and as long as the cause was imported from outside our boundaries we would have a good chance of stopping it. Police in airports do have access to guns I believe. We would have to mobilise and protect our borders from mainland Europe, France and Belgium mainly. The risk would come from those bitten as Zombies are unlikely to get on a boat, fly plane etc. so it would depend on how quickly people turned, if they were already in transit then they would most likely be arriving at a recognised airport/sea port and could be controlled there. We would have to permanently block the channel tunnel as well of course. The UK is quite capable of self sufficiency and does not need to import anything really, although we’d have to go without a lot of things it would sill be a decent existence I think.

If the outbreak originates here then we are more likely to be screwed though.

[IrishZombieKiller]

VEE after watching 28 Days, NOPE. No one is safe. There is no way to stop these, unless we screen EVERYONE and it did not help.

[Cunning Plan]

Re: Falkland Islands.

good shout! unfortunately, I'd have no way of getting there, being in England. :(

[Cunning Plan]

Surely, the best plan is to avoid the major military installations because the soldiers there would be the first to be deployed out to control/ save the population. Therefore, smaller reserve bases or military training areas would be best (as we've seen in WA). there are firearms available in the UK, you just have to find the right places, e.g. Cadet centres, police divisional HQs, Territorial army bases etc. Of these, you are most likely to get an unattended Cadet centre than anywhere else because very few people will think of them.

The downside of this could be that
A) there are very limited stocks of ammunition or only blank training rounds available (which would necessitate some serious Macguyvering to make them more lethal).
B) that the weapons would be in a poor state of upkeep and therefore be less reliable.

still worth a shot though

[2bgood]

Hmmm, thinking about it, the UK might very well be OK. We are quite a small island really and as long as the cause was imported from outside our boundaries we would have a good chance of stopping it. Police in airports do have access to guns I believe. We would have to mobilise and protect our borders from mainland Europe, France and Belgium mainly. The risk would come from those bitten as Zombies are unlikely to get on a boat, fly plane etc. so it would depend on how quickly people turned, if they were already in transit then they would most likely be arriving at a recognised airport/sea port and could be controlled there. We would have to permanently block the channel tunnel as well of course. The UK is quite capable of self sufficiency and does not need to import anything really, although we’d have to go without a lot of things it would sill be a decent existence I think.

If the outbreak originates here then we are more likely to be screwed though.

We're alive Zombies swim pretty good, the Channel not that wide....

[2bgood]

There must be smaller independent farms with a range of products though? I suppose this is the problem with western countries, we use technology as a chair or ladder to elevate us to greater and greater heights. When the ladder is kicked away we face a hard fall that we might not survive.
Lots of them. I have one in my back yard, that feeds 40 families a year.